056- All things cats, with Stacy LeBaron
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Summary:
Cats can sometimes get a bad wrap, especially with those who don't care for them regularly. Stacy LeBaron, host of the Community Cats podcast, joins us to cover why that is, how to care for different temperments of cats, and so much more.
Topics on this episode:
Why are cats an afterthought most times?
Caring for “aggressive” cats
Biggest misconceptions of cat behavior
Caring for declawed cats
How to get involved and favorite resources
Main take away? Don’t let cats be an afterthought for either you or your clients. Take the time to get to know the cats you’re caring for.
About our guest:
Stacy LeBaron has been involved in animal welfare for over 20 years. She currently hosts a weekly podcast called the Community Cats Podcast where she interviews nationally and internationally renowned experts helping with the problem of cat overpopulation and cat welfare.
Previous to starting the podcast, Stacy served for 16 years as president of the Merrimack River Feline Rescue Society (MRFRS). Under her leadership, the MRFRS assisted over 105,000 cats and kittens through a variety of innovative programs. Among the MRFRS’s programs are two mobile spay/neuter clinics, known as the Catmobiles, and an adoption center in Salisbury, MA. During her tenure with MRFRS, Stacy also served as a board member and oversaw the MRFRS mentoring program, as well as co-chaired the organization’s Development Committee, growing the budget from $45,000 a year to $1.5 million dollars. The MRFRS Mentoring Program, which began in 2011, assisted 11,000 cats through its work with 77 different animal welfare groups in 14 states.
An expert in her field, Stacy is a current member of the Shelter Medicine Committee at the Cummings School of Veterinary Medicine at Tufts University, an adviser to the Massachusetts Animal Coalition (MAC), Vice President of the Board for PAWSitive Pantry in Vermont, and committee member for HubCats Chelsea. She is a past board member of MAC and the New England Federation of Humane Societies. She serves as the current administrative trustee for the LeBaron Foundation. Stacy also facilitates two smaller coalitions in Massachusetts, the Boston Homeless Cats group and Merrimack Valley Partnership. Stacy graduated from Vassar College. She now lives in Vermont with her husband, son, daughter and one cat.
Links:
The Community Cats Podcast: https://www.communitycatspodcast.com/about/
Stacy on LInkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/communitycatspodcast/
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A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE
Provided by otter.ai
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
cat, litter box, people, pet sitter, called, veterinarians, dogs, pet, neutered, toys, resources, kittens, shelter, programs, conference, scratching, put, year, feline leukemia, community
SPEAKERS
Collin, Stacy
00:17
I'm Collin and I'm Meghan. And this is
00:20
pet sitter confessional. An open and honest discussion about life as a pet sitter brought to you by
Collin 00:25
time to pet. Well, hello, everybody and welcome back. Now, you may have noticed that there's been one topic that we really haven't covered yet on our podcast. And that is, well, cats. So to remedy that we brought on the host of the community cats podcast, Stacy. Stacy is a wealth of information and I cannot overstate that enough. When it comes to all things, cats. Her experience, passion and dedication To that in volumes, so we are really excited to get to share this episode with you. And let's get started.
Stacy 01:08
Oh, Colin, thank you so much for having me on the show. And yeah, for folks that don't know me. I'm Stacey lebaron and I am the host of the community cats podcast. We started our show back in 2016. And we have had over about 330 episodes. So yes, if you don't know much about cats, that community cats podcast is the place to be to find out anything and everything about cats. And so the reason I started the show was because I had run a nonprofit organization in Massachusetts called the Merrimack River, feline rescue society. I ran that organization for about 16 years. And in that period of time, we assisted about 75,000 cats through our spay neuter programs. We had two mobile clinics called cat mobile's. We had an adoption center. It was one of The first cage lists adoption centers for cats in Massachusetts and around the country. And we also had quite a few programs for feral cats or at that point in time, we would call them feral cats now we call them more community cats and they were free spay neuter programs for our feral cats in the community, you get them spayed or neutered, and you get a little ear tip taken off their ear, give them a rabies vaccine, and we put them back out into the community, which would help reduce the cat overpopulation that so many shelters were faced with. This was back way, way back when in the 90s. I can't believe I'm saying that but way back when in the 90s, when we were faced with a lot of overpopulation in our shelters around the country. I moved to Vermont and I sort of retired from my day to day work at in Massachusetts with the with the shelter, and I wanted to do something else and I had done a mentoring program. I had worked with ad organizations across the country, helping them start these trips. knew to return programs and I had 400 groups on my waiting list 400 groups around the country that wanted help with starting a cat program for community cats. And I couldn't leave those folks behind. I never did when someone called me wanting to ask for help for a cat, you know, in their backyard or if the even had a question about their own cat. I never wanted to leave that person behind. I wanted to always make sure we got gave them a phone call and gave them some resources. And that was true with these groups. And so I started this podcast, and it's been a great journey. It's a lot of fun. We have a lot of incredible programs, and we're helping lots and lots of cats.
Collin 03:42
That's absolutely incredible. I mean, over 75,000 cats assisted through that program alone while you were running it and then to then move on and expand across the country. I mean, where did your passion for cats come from?
Stacy 03:55
Yeah, that's actually one of my themes for the podcast is turn your passion for cats into action. So I'm glad you brought up that word passion. That's it's a big, big part of who I am and my show and and it's my hope is always my hope that when folks will listen to my show that they will really turn their passion for cats into action. It was very organic how it happened to me. I mean, I obviously I grew up with a cat, a very mean grumpy old cat. But I grew up with a cat named Duncan who lived to the ripe old age of 20. And I still have the scars on the back of my hands as a little child. So Duncan and I found a balance of power and got along well during those years, but I've always had one at least one cat in my life. I I definitely had more cats while I was working at the shelter because I would foster kittens and I also have a very big soft spot for the older cats. So whenever someone would surrender a 10 year old cat to the shelter, it usually ended up in my office at my house. But how I got introduced to the shelter and world was I basically I brought a bag of food In one day, to this new shelter, I'd been driving by the sign and I thought, Oh, well, I can donate some food. And so I did and my name got on their mailing list. And then they sent out an appeal letter, you know, fundraising letter, and I sent in a $50 donation. And then they sent out another letter saying they needed a board member for to be secretary and I thought, well, I can type and I have a computer and that kind of thing. And so that year, I became their Secretary on their board the next year, I was vice president and then they year after that, I became president of the organization and I was in that position for 16 years.
05:36
My goodness, so yeah, you
Collin 05:40
just my mind blowing and I just really appreciate the the kind of information knowledge that you are out sharing and you mentioned you've had cats, you know, throughout your entire life. Um, do you have any cats now?
Stacy 05:54
I do. I do. I only have one cat and his name is huge. And he was a A feral he was trapped for one of our free Sunday spay neuter clinics. And he was trapped with another cat so that there was Turner and hooch. Okay, um, and Turner got neutered and he got ear tipped and he was returned back to his colony but who had a wound what was called is called a wound of unknown origin. And in Massachusetts, if you have a if you're a cat, you have a wound of unknown origin and you're not able to produce a rabies certificate which he was not able to produce. Then you have to go into what's called a six month rabies quarantine, and so which came to stay at my house for six months as a foster and he turned into or he was a very loving and friendly boy cat, and he is fit positive. And that was a non issue for us. So that was back when he was estimated to be about a year and a half old, and he's now 12 years old and sleeping happily over on the bed. The other part of the room.
Collin 07:01
No goodness. Oh, that's so sweet. I one of the cats that I had when I was going to college, we named him Jasper and I remember sitting in the vet's office he was he was found on our front porch at the house that we were running at the time. And all of his whiskers had been cut off really super short to his face. And he had on two or three of these flea collars, and he was really, you know, acted pretty weird as far as like, neurologically. And I remember sitting in the vet's office as they were checking him out and sitting waiting to see that fit that F HIV test, whether it connect positive or negative, just absolutely wrecked with nerves, because I didn't know how I would handle that. And so it you mentioned that he is positive but it it doesn't seem to be that big of a deal in his life. Is that easily managed these days?
Stacy 07:54
Yeah. So F IV is feline immunodeficiency virus. So basically, they are A little bit autoimmune compromised. So cat with F IV can live with cats that are negative for F IV. They don't have to be separate. They can live together as long as they're not fighting seriously. So F IV is transferred through extremely deep bite wounds. So that's usually when you have unneutered cats fighting. Once a cat is neutered, then the spread of the disease is very negligent. Now there's something else called feline leukemia. So usually we have what's called a combo test, and a cat is tested for HIV and feline leukemia. feline leukemia is a much more contagious virus, but it's not a death sentence. The organization that I was with Merrimack River feline rescue society has been adopting out feline leukemia positive cat since 1998. feline leukemia positive cats though, should be in family With other feline leukemia positive cats, where they should be only cats, if they're positive as kittens, their lifespan can be shortened a bit. But yet, usually, and I hate to have this conversation with people, but when they're cats time has come who has feline leukemia, it's usually a pretty quick process. It's not long and drawn out, I just had back in March, I had it one of my cats passed away from oral cancer. And that, you know, it was a pretty long and drawn out months and months process, which was great. It gave me enough time to be able to sort of say my goodbyes and everything. But also, there's just it's just just a lot of sort of suffering and negotiating that goes on as to like, what's the time the best time? You know, do you let mother nature take its course or do you euthanize? I mean, those are all very challenging questions that we have in the dog and the cat world. But with feline leukemia, when a cat does Sort of succumbed to the disease, it's usually pretty fast. Now, if there's an adult cat that has feline leukemia, they can very easily live to be in that 789 10 year range and you know, have a really good life with a family and that kind of thing. So, we, adoption programs for feline leukemia are growing at a substantial win rate. And they're even, there's a cat cafe out in Seattle and another one in Chicago at treehouse humane, that have feline leukemia positive cats in their cat cafe. So, you know, the public really gets some education and exposure around the disease and not to be afraid of it.
Collin 10:38
Yeah, because there is just a lot of unknown things about you know, with young leukemia and EF f IV, because it's not talked a lot about and that's something that you're really passionate about as part of your mission is education in dialogue. And why do you think that's so necessary and important when dealing with cats specifically?
Stacy 10:59
Well, so I think people are, you know, just uncertain about what sort of the diseases are. I mean, many people have indoor outdoor cats. So there are a lot of different issues that that come to play with cats, you know, there's also parasites, there's fleas, there's worms, and that kind of thing, because they're mousers. And they may eat rodents that have, you know, various, you know, diseases that then turn into tapeworms or whatever from that standpoint. So, unfortunately, our veterinarians out there, you know, there's only so much time in the day that they can provide education. And so I think the beauty of the internet, there's, there's also there's bad news, and there's good news on the internet, that's for sure. But I think that if you look hard enough, you'll be able to find, you know, the good news, and that, really with regards to disease and cats were a lot more farther along the progressive lines than we certainly weren't even 10 years ago.
Collin 11:59
A lot of people have dogs in the forefront of their minds when they when people say I'm a pet sitter, why do you think dogs take up such an inordinately large amount of the collective thought of people as opposed to cats?
Stacy 12:12
So Well, from a financial standpoint, as a pet sitter, you're gonna make more money with regards to dogs. And that's just the reality of the matter. dog owners put a lot more money into their pets into their dogs than cats do. Now, that gap between the amount of dollars that you're willing to put into your cats versus the dogs, I believe is getting a little bit narrower, because there are certainly many urban areas now where the more of the population own cats than they own dogs. So you know, there's getting to be a little bit of an inversion happening, but traditionally speaking my language 10 years ago would be well, cats are sort of known as pets of the poor and also as your age. income levels go down the number of cats you have go up. And as your income level goes up, the number of dogs you have go up. So veterinary practices, pet sitters, food, specialty food stores, you know, 75% of your business or more is going to be around dogs. I'm not saying that's, I feel like that will change over time because I feel like cats are finally coming into the range of dogs where we're pampering our cats. We're providing extra stimulation. It's more important for me to have you know, for my cat who I'll have a pet sitter here, come here three times a day because he's a very he does not like to be alone. He's He's like a dog in that way where he's just has some separation anxiety issues. So I'll have a pet sitter come three times a day to come and spend an hour You know, each time just watching a movie with him but he'll hang out on our own. lap and all that stuff. And understanding that the more enrichment you can provide your cat, the fewer behavioral issues you're going to have. So in using hooches my example also, some of the previous time when I had a lot more cats, he was a sprayer and he would spray in the house. And now he does not spray in the house. And you know, so as a pet sitter. And as a cat owner, we're going to be using pet sitters a lot more rather than just, you know, sort of having somebody come in and put some food down on the floor for the cat. You know, every day or two
Collin 14:38
cats and felines, they tend to have this view of these solitary creatures who just kind of stuck around and only come out at certain times, but they really are social, at least some can be and so noticing and what what your cat does or doesn't require is really important as to whether you're going to ask for a pet sitter or if you are a pet sitter. The time and effort you should be putting in whenever you are caring for.
Stacy 15:05
Right and as a pet sitter, and as you're meeting potential clients, it's really important for you to be able to say, you know, I'm not just putting the food down and scooping the litter box, you know, I'll you tell me what their favorite toys are you tell me, what are the things they like, you know, is there a bed that I need to make sure that is, you know, in a certain way, or do they, you know, one thing you know, cats will do is they'll scratch at their beds or whatever, so they'll mess things up. So, you know, are there certain things that I need to make sure that that you know, I pay attention to you know, there's their special hiding places. So that then you're not going to worry if you can't find the cat, you know, are there places they like to take it now, my cats if my other house, two of them used to love sleeping up back up in the back closet, you know, and if I didn't share that information with my pet sitter, she would have thought she'd lost two cats. And so, you know, she would have been, you know, all worried and on the phone because, you know, she'd want to make sure that Check on everybody to make sure everybody is okay. So as a pet sitter, if you go in and say, you know, well, what makes your cat happy? Or what do you do? Or do you have a routine? You know, does your cat expect to be played with before getting dinner and then the cat will sleep through the night? You know? I mean, you really do we think, oh, we have to go take the dog for a walk. Well, you really have to walk your cat to not necessarily walk the cat outside, but you can if you want to there's you can have leashes and take your cat out for a walk. But just in terms of making sure that there's enough, you know, engagement and an entertainment and enrichment. One of the programs that I do is an online behavior day, which is an online webinar. And all we're talking about is cat behavior issues we have to feline behaviorist. And so it's from 10am to 5pm. And it's, you know, talking about well, different litter box issues and favorite kinds of litter and your best cat toys or, and then you bring your favorite toys to as a pet sitter. It's good for you. No, well what are what would be my favorite cat toy? You know, if I were a cat Do you know I could bring a cat dancer toy in, which is like this little rolled up paper thing on a on a newspaper on a big piano wire. It's as simple as little toy. But yet, all of my cats have loved it. And it's a fantastic toy. So you know many things, there are many things out if your cat is misbehaving in any way, shape or form, the more you can do to engage with that cat, the better now, there are definitely some very shy cats out there. And you know, you have to figure out a different way they they do want to communicate with you, but there's a different way of communicating with them. So, you know, you just have to learn how to speak their language.
Collin 17:44
So So on that note, I mean, one of the common things talked about in PetSmart communities is they have a cat and it's just super aggressive. It doesn't want to be around them at all. It hides immediately. What is a sitter do in that kind of situation.
Stacy 18:00
So, well obviously it's hard to comment with it being just sort of generalized because it you know, if the family you know, cats can have reactions to different people in different ways. And there's a woman Pam Johnson Bennett. And she has written quite a few books, feline behavior books. And one of them is think like a cat. There's another book called psycho Kitty, which I love. And another book called Harrison tell those are two of my favorite books from her. And they're small. They're these little little books. And there's some great resources in there in terms of figuring out you know, what, what is up with your cat? Why is your Why is your cat aggressive? And, you know, is there something they is triggering it? You know, are you triggering it? I mean, is it a multi cat household? Is there a dog in the house? Are there kids in the house? what's what's causing behavior is the behavior you know with the people is the behavior with you is there are you wearing some perfume that's bothering the cat? There's just you know, it's a whole range of thing things. From my standpoint, it's very rare that I hear of like, Oh, I walking into the house and like, Cujo is attacking my leg. Yeah, that's sort of a rarity. Usually it's cat sees you up. You're not my mom. I'm out of here. Yeah. And, and that's, that's okay. I mean, there's definitely you have to have a relationship. We, we don't know what happened in the past life of that cat. So you know, as long as they're running away and they're not limping away or something like that as a pet sitter, that's, that's okay. You know, that's fine. And you do go out and you do your business and you know, give them the new food and new litter. Sometimes you can make friends with them. If you know where their hiding spot is, and you can, you know, put an extra special treat near where they're hiding. And then you might see when you come back that that treat has been eaten. You know, I mean, you want to love them with, you know, with food first, because that's the best way but that's being super aggressive. Always people will say, Well, is there a medical issue? Are they in pain? Is there something from that standpoint, especially if they're acting aggressive, and they weren't aggressive with the family while the family was there, but it's very rare that you have a really aggressive cat.
Collin 20:31
Sure. And I think the big takeaway from there is that the cat's not just being a jerk, right like there's something that that you can learn about in start investing in the cat that you're that's under your care and take some time to be intentional about getting to know them. Looking at some of these resources for Pam Johnson Bennett and and really start just stop writing it off. Right that that's because that tends to happen is when someone goes out to cats a jerk. They're just always going to be a jerk. There's no I think I can do about that. Everybody knows those cats that really like to come out and play and all of a sudden, it seems like a flip switches and they attack your hand scratch and then run off. And someone will say, Oh, my cats just being a jerk right now, is that really what's going on though is they know what's going on there.
Stacy 21:16
So that's the point where the cat's been overstimulated. And so that is basically the cat's way of saying, you know, what, you're not seeing my signals here. And so, you know, that's part of that learning process. And we are, unfortunately, we are, you know, in such a way where we're not as aware of what the cat's trying to tell us as we are about Oh, like we're gonna play. And so you have to just be really careful to learn and understand what's going on, you know, with the cat, especially if you're Say, say you've got a cat that, you know, maybe a little bit easily overstimulated, and you've got like, Got a group of three friends or four friends visiting, you're in the house, it's a little bit loud, there's a lot of stuff going on. If it can't, feels like they don't have control over their space, they're gonna get really weird. And so if you're like, hey, let me show you miss these little trick, you know, or something like that. Cats aren't as excited about that. They're not they are trainable. You can do clicker training with cats. Okay, um, and a lot of people recommend trying clicker training. That's actually the biggest sort of fad right now is using clicker training to help with some behavioral issues. So you could certainly look into doing clicker training, especially if you're a dog person and you understand what clicker training is all about. You certainly can transfer that into cats to help them with their behavior. And, and it has worked out really well. And also there's a program which is oriented towards veterinary visits and stuff, but it's called fear free and it's up It's a way of just sort of calming things down, especially when you have to take your cat to the veterinarian. But there are also some good behavioral tips there too, for just, you know, understanding and keeping peace in the household and stuff, but really respect your cat. And if your cat's not the type of cat that's going to like seeing people that they don't know, and that kind of stuff, you know, put them in a safe space, put them in the bedroom, put them in the bathroom with a litter box, put them in a place where they know they're going to be safe and they don't and then they're not going to be as unpredictable as you might think.
Collin 23:33
We're talking a lot about cat behavior here. What are some of the biggest misconceptions of cat behavior? Or have we already mentioned some of them?
Stacy 23:41
So the misconceptions about cat behavior? Well, certainly I think a lot of misconceptions are that cats are doing the behavior, you know, because they're mad at you. So you know, a cat pees on you know, somebody's luggage when they come home from a trip or something like that, and they're doing saying, oh, they're doing this out of spite and that kind of thing. And that's, you know, that's not necessarily the attitude to have because they're also cats are very sensitive. So, you know, we just have to, you know, understand that we're having a very difficult time communicating and we need to be able to cross this bridge together and understand that it's not time for you to pee on my, my suitcase, but maybe the next time I bring my suitcase, you know, into the house, maybe I'm not going to put it on the floor, maybe I will put in a place where the cat can because there's hotel smells there. There's, you know, something funny that's bothering them. You know, if a cat is peeing or pooping outside of the litter box, that's not intentional. They're trying to tell you something. Either you're not you're not using the right litter you're not using the right box you're not you know, they're they just really would rather go outside. They would you know, it's just you know, I I can tell everybody I mean pooch has the best capable Have flinging cat litter across the room as any cat I've ever seen, he probably has the biggest biceps of any cat out there, because he is just so irritated that I make him use that litter box, because I don't let him out in Vermont because they're just too many wild critters, but he wasn't indoor outdoor cat, Massachusetts, and I had to make them an indoor cat here. And it's the one part of that indoor only life that he is really irritated with. So the cat litter does get all over the room. But you know, at least he is going in the litter box and I respect that and I keep it as clean as possible for him because he really likes a clean box. Every cat really likes a clean box. So that's really important to stress that if you have multiple cats in your household, you should have the same number of boxes that you have for cats and then add another one. And ideally if you do have a house, a big house where you're on like multiple floors, ideally it's good to have boxes on every floor. I know that's not necessarily convenient for people. But that's what's convenient for cats, is having litter boxes on every floor. And you don't, because you don't want to have six cats and have seven litter boxes all in one space. Because what if they all need to use the litter box at the same time, they're going to all be fighting because you all are going to be over that same that same area. So you know, those are just some of the little tips, you know, that are out there with regards to behavior scratching is another hot topic. Cat scratching, make sure that there's horizontal scratching options as well as vertical and that they're solid. So if you scratch, cat scratching and something and it's tippy, they're not going to want to do it because they don't want to bonking them in the head. So you want to make sure that they're solid. Some prefer sisal scratching the string like stuff. Other prefer more of like the carpeting like that's not as well recommended but some cats use to try and find their texture and then also some cats from Really like the horizontal cardboard things, you can get them in the grocery store and you put catnip in them. And so you can, you know, use that but a lot of people forget that cats like horizontal scratching as well as the vertical option. And so it's important to not forget that because that's the way that they can sort of, you know, D sharpen their claws. Now, you know, ever since I've been I've been down to two cats and I have not had any furniture scratching going on. If you do have furniture, scratchers, make sure you put your scratchers near where they're scratching so that they can scratch on the scratching post rather than the furniture. They're also sort of some drapery cover things that you can put over that furniture and I mean, if you're really, if you got plenty of money, you can buy a button, not necessarily a vegan person. leather couches are impossible to scratch. So, you know those take cat wear and tear very well so if you can move away from them, you know sort of material than then the leather wears well but honestly if you have enough scratching options in the house for the cats, they're not going to go for the furniture. You can there are some citrus products you can spray on the furniture to that don't cause staining that make it just kind of a nasty smell. Decline is not an option. It is illegal to declaw cats in in New York, it's illegal to do it in England. It's it's an amputation of the of the bone on the on the fingers basically. So if you want there's nail caps you can put on and certainly you know you can easily add some pet pet sitters offer this service and if you are of that inclination, you can make a good amount of money offering to do nail trims of the cats that are amenable to having their nails trimmed.
Collin 29:01
What you're really pointing out there is that when you are enriching the cat's environment, when you are in getting the cat engaged, you can really cut back on a lot of those concerns that people have with scratching, because that's tends to be something that can happen with brand new cats or maybe old cats where their environment changes and all sudden they start scratching, and a lot of people's first responses will will get them declawed. Oh, there are the we can we can they use lasers these days, they're not crushing bones. So we'll just get them declawed. And then we'll never have to worry about that. But there's so much better options of simply as providing a few more scratching posts in horizontal and vertical so that it's there is more enriched, so you don't have to go down that road.
Stacy 29:48
Well, it's also it's a cat's way of marking their territory marking their space. And to be honest, if you're worried about scratching and you have them declawed, they're gonna start But there's something in the statistic of like, almost 75% of cats that are dickwad either become biters or they become inappropriate litter box users. So they will use their mouth or the other end to sort of try and use that as a way of owning their space. And they can be living a life in chronic pain in their, with their paws being mutated in that way. Right?
Collin 30:25
Yeah. So for those of you listening, if you have clients or if you've ever thought about that, the calling is totally off the table and not an option ever. There are much better options out there.
Stacy 30:34
Yeah. And and many of you, though, may also be caring for cats that are already declawed. Yeah, and, and over the years, you know, we've had, I've even had some Persian cats surrender to us that had the front and the back paws. And so that, you know, they they basically hit a wood floor and they just went splat right out because there was no way to grip on the floor, you know, there's nothing to hold on to So it's important for you to really know and understand if you are dealing with a declawed cat too, because then you might be more aware of the fact that they might be more of a biter. And you know, just because it's their only way of defending themselves and so just when you're petting them, just, you'll have that understanding of of that being a potential, you know, option out there for the cat. And, you know, always, you know, let the cat develop the relationship and then you know, you guys will go together and create a new friendship.
Collin 31:38
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31:42
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Collin 31:58
This decision was a good one. If you are looking for new pet sitting software for your business give time to pet a try. As a listener of pet sitter confessional, you'll get 50% off your first three months when you sign up at time to pet.com slash confessional. You mentioned it a little bit with with your cat hooch currently, he wasn't an outdoor now he's living an indoor life. What are your thoughts on indoor outdoor cats?
32:25
Yeah, so I mean I think that it is
Stacy 32:31
very much dependent upon this owner cat relationship. And so I can't necessarily say all cats should be indoor only cats and I can't say that all cat should be indoor outdoor. Or everybody should be a barn cat but or working cat. I think that there's a place for cats in all of those avenues and, and I wish I could say that this was one of the greatest challenges that we had when We were doing adoptions because we're trying to place a cat with a family. And, you know, finding the right, the right balance the right combination is it's really an art form. And, you know, I wish I could say it was all perfect. I, you know, ideally, you know, indoor only has the longest lifespan for cats. But is that the longest healthspan I don't know, because an indoor only cat tends to be more obese. It's less stimulated, it doesn't cats need to hunt, they love to hunt. It's in their DNA, it's part of who they are. And if they aren't able to utilize those skills, they become bored. They become you know, they become more susceptible to other other situations. But then again, as an indoor outdoor cat, their lifespan may be shorter. Obviously, if you live on a busy road, you're going to have an indoor only cat because you don't want the cat to get hit by a car. But you know, here I am in rural Vermont and I've decided to keep my cat in just because the wildlife situation so when I, which was indoor outdoor, it was like more of a suburban environment. But, you know, he did, he did hunt a lot of moles and mice and those kinds of things. And, you know, we had to deal with fleas. And you know, he had tapeworms. So there are also those kinds of consequences to putting, you know, chemicals, but advantage or frontline or whatever on his, you know, and I necessarily like putting all those chemicals on him too. So, I wish I could have the like the golden ball of saying that, you know, every cat needs to be this way. I think if you make the commitment to have an indoor only cat, you're making a commitment to more than having just an indoor cat, you've got to make a commitment to you know, I try and play with him as much as possible. You know, we just really engage with him. So he's Not just sort of closing around,
Collin 35:02
right? Yeah. And I like I like that of not necessarily a one size fits all, but really thorough, well thought out what that's going to look like for the longevity for the life of that cat as long as it's in your care as long as you because you're gonna be taking care of it for a very long time. And that decision is not the same for everybody across the country. And it's situation by situation. And I like that, that there's there's so much more that goes into Oh, do they just go outside for a little bit? You know, there are things you need to be thinking about when you decide to open that door and let them outside. And it's not just a I'll let them back in when they come back. Kind of
Stacy 35:41
Right. Right. And now, I mean, there's a huge trend now around adventure cats and explorer cats. Oh, yeah. And they're these really weird looking backpacks. So you can put your cat in this backpack and it's like got this bubble and it's got an airspace and the stuff so you can you can travel with your cat Now as has become really popular, and actually huge does have a leash. And like a it's actually it's a small dogs, like, leash type thing. And so I can take them out for walks, but I'll be honest, I really don't do it that often because it sort of makes him crazy because it's like, I give him a flavor of it and then he like wants to be out all the time. And so I I can't do it very often because it I feel like it's just it's unfair, and that's a commitment. I can't I'm not making at this point in time, which is to have him out on the leash with me. 24 seven.
36:41
Yeah. So,
Stacy 36:42
um, you know, it's, it's one of those things, but, you know, I never know I usually take him out a few times a year and and you know, like in the wintertime now with the snow, he won't want to stay out very long so I could take him out and he'd be like, wait a minute, why are you taking me out here this is not where I want to go. But that I sort of feel like giving them a taste of the outdoors?
Collin 37:02
Yeah. So let's say a sitter, a pet sitter just gets their first cat client that they're going to take care of, what are some things that they should be aware of, or make sure that they ask the owner about so that they can give the best care that they can't?
Stacy 37:19
Yeah, so if the owner doesn't have this already put together, it'd be really good for you to have a little checklist ahead of time, which I would assume you do with your dog clients, you know, sort of how much food do you feed them? Typically, when do you feed them? What do you feed them? Where's the food kept? Are the is the cat on any medication? What's the veterinarians name that they go to if there is an emergency? What should you do? I always leave an envelope with some money in it in case there has to go to emergency vet or anything like that. I mean, we do have credit cards now and phones and stuff like that. So I can only Call the emergency clinic. But I did have a situation once where my I was in Europe and my cat sitter had to take my cat to the emergency clinic in Boston, the cat ended up being hospitalized for a week while I was still out of town. And but, you know, it was great that she was able to do that. And she knew what to do. Also all the cat's veterinary records in a, you know, in a folder. And then also, you know, favorite toys, cat litter supplies, and all those kinds of things and where the cat likes to hide. Those would be all the sort of the critical things to do to ask about. And then there's more of the standard stuff, sort of, you know, what to do if power goes out or you know, some of those other kinds of household type things, but, yeah, from the CAD standpoint, you know, just sort of anything, obviously, medications and anything from that standpoint. The other thing you can do too, is There's a product called feel away. And it's a it's like a fair gnome. And so you can spray it on a towel. And, you know, if you come in and you bring that there's a lot of cats sometimes really just sort of like it and they just sort of like sit on and it just, it's a calming thing. And so that's something that they use quite a bit in veterinary practices to try and soothe cats. Usually, they drape a towel that's been sprayed in it over the carrier just so that they can get a little bit of a sense of it. There's plugins that are in the house, or that are in the veterinarian's office, and you could actually even say, you know, hey, if your cats are really agitated at maybe these feel away, plugins would be good. So they're just not going to get so stressed out when I'm coming in and out.
Collin 39:43
Wow. So I mean, there's, I love that resource because a lot of people, you know, if especially if it's the first time the owner is leaving, or maybe if it's the first time the sitter is taking care of a cat, they may be nervous, making the cat nervous and unsure of what's going on. So just knowing that there are things that you can Do or have the owner do ahead of time to begin prepping for your your first visit to help that goes smoothly for everybody involved.
Stacy 40:09
Right? I mean, if you really want to go you know, crazy to there are CBD treats and so you know you can have them at the CBD is more for like pain and that kind of thing, but it also just sort of chills the cat out and they're like little little treats and that I think the other thing too, that a lot of the pet sitters that I've had over the years because they know I worry so much about my cats is that if it is possible, they'll take a picture or video and they'll text it to me and or they'll just text and say hey, you know just let you know I'm here and I did my stuff and all as well and that kind of thing. And from a standpoint of being someone who's on vacation, to sort of knowing that, you know, somebody has checked in and everything is okay. Makes my vacation that much better.
Collin 40:56
Yeah, absolutely. And that can be challenging, especially if there's a cat that does have a hidey hole that either you don't know about it or it, they have a couple that the owner forgot to tell you. So there can be a few tense moments where the pet sitter, you're walking around the house trying to figure out where this cat is. So you can get one of those proof of life photos and say, you know, I found the cat, this is where the or it's only I shine, but you know, they're, they're up in the closet.
Stacy 41:22
Right, right. And I mean, that's definitely Yeah, the way if it's a shy cat or whether whatever, I mean, I, I had a cat that I would call a newseum, um, and so but you know, they would be like, well, I, I put the plate of food down in the closet, my food was eaten. So I'm assuming it's, you know, it's okay because you don't want to stick your nose in so aggressively that you're going to like scare him, too. So you have to sort of get an owner, a pet owner would understand that and be like, don't worry about Don't worry about finding you know, the other cat I understand you know, but as long as you can see the ones that you're supposed to see Yeah, you know, they're okay. And that kind of thing.
Collin 42:03
Yeah, that's really important. If they have multiple cats having a conversation, which ones do you expect? Do you think I will see which ones will I never see that we know see him? Right as in taking notes.
Stacy 42:16
Right, right. I mean, I've had so I've had cats too. So the other things to think about too, or, you know, are there places that they could get into that they shouldn't get into, I mean, hopefully they have cat proofed their house but I've had my cats get into heating vents and those kinds of things too. So I'm just there you know, if if they are nervous or agitated because the household is different, or whatever, you know, are there places that the owner really should make sure a really, you know, locked down so they're not going to pull open the flap behind the tub and get in behind the tub and that kind of thing. So there's there are a lot of places or get under the sink. You know, where the chemicals are in everything. You know, a lot of cats like to break into cupboards, that kind of thing. So just, you're depending on the owner really knowing their cat. And actually by asking these questions, you're you'll get a better sense of how well do they really engage or not engage with their pet?
Collin 43:17
Yeah. And help you meet, meet and exceed their expectations in the long run. Yeah, yeah. So um, this year has been a really big year for you. You've got had a lot going on. We would love for you to share a little bit about what you've done and what you have planned coming up.
Stacy 43:34
Yeah, yeah. 2020 has been a big year. So early in the year I had an online cap conference, which happens every year. It's usually around the last weekend in January. And that was really focused on community cat issues. So what to do if you have a cat that strays through your backyard a couple of times? You know, do you worry Do you not worry? Is it a stray cat? Is it an old cat is it a committee cat, that kind of thing. So we really focused on some of those issues as well as barn cat programs and some other things around spaying and neutering and educational opportunities. And then we had an online behavior day. And that was in February. That was I had mentioned that earlier where we were talking with two behaviorists Rachel Geller, as well as Tabitha Sarah. And those two have both been on my podcast. So if you go to the community, cats podcast calm, go into the search bar, but either Tabitha or Rachel, their podcasts would come right up if you're interested in listening to more cat behavior stuff. they've both been on my podcast. And then we also have a webinar series with an organization called neighborhood cats. And they are doing an incredible job trapping community cats in Maui right now. And They do four webinars a year with us on trappers tips and tricks, how to take care of barrels, returned to field. And there is a product called a drop trap that a lot of people use when they're trapping feral cats and community cats. And so they're really pros on that. And so they're doing a range of different type of educational things. And then in June of this year, we are going to have the online kitten conference, and that's going to be June 14 through 16th. I'd highly recommend you check it out. If you're thinking about being a foster home for cats or kittens, or potentially adopting great resources, there's a lot of behavioral stuff, a lot of stuff on how to take care of kittens. And so that's online kitten conference, calm and I'm doing that in partnership with the National getting coalition. We're also going to To be at a whole slew of different conferences this year. So I have been speaking at the New England federation of humane societies, and HS us Expo. And we go to a conference called cat camp, which is in New York City. And then there's also one in DC which is in DC. So there are a bazillion different cat conferences all around the country there. It's been like tripling the number of cat conferences. There's pop cats, there's cat con. There's like snow cats, silicon cats. I can I cannot tell you how many. There's a Oh, Ashbury. There's cat Academy. There's another one that's in Jersey. There's one. There's one in Montreal, when Chicago best friends has a conference. I mean, I can conference myself every weekend if I want to. And that's just new within like the last two or three years and that's another reason why I say folks are really embracing Cats are much more just individual owners of cats feel like it's a responsibility to get more involved in the cat community. And I really see that happening with the uptick in the growth of these cat conferences. There's cats, fun play education, you know, dress up, I mean, it's all put together in one big conference center or whatever. And it seems to be doing well. And people are, you know, making enough money at it to keep it going.
Collin 47:26
Yeah, that's, that's really exciting. And, you know, just to think of all those kind of all those cat conferences going on the growth that's there. And what I want to point out is, if you're a pet sitter, maybe going to the cat conference isn't your thing or what you want to be doing. But have that in mind, so that whenever so you can recommend it to one of your clients that has a cat, ask them, Hey, I know that you love your cats. Did you know that this cat conferences going on nearby during these dates, so that you can be that resource and that you You can help continue to educate your clients over time so that they become better pet owners, they can better work with you too, as part of that being a great resource to your clients, not just there to take care of them. But there's this educational aspect to that you can be really a keystone in throughout the care of their pet.
Stacy 48:20
Oh, yeah, definitely. And by going to these conferences, you're going to be exposed to as much cat swag as possible in terms of, you know, these are the new toys. These are the best, you know, cat water fountains and you know, so everything is out there and I interviewed a guy that we met at, at cat camp, and he designs these incredible water bowls that are for cats and dogs that they can't bend all the way down and they they can't even drink out of a flagpole. So it has to be at a certain angle. And so he's done all this like 3d printing of these special bowls for cats and dogs that have this certain condition. And, you know, so you can find out all these different like options and opportunities for special needs animals too.
Collin 49:12
And that is such a niche market. But such an underserved market is people who have special needs pets, who sometimes feel like they don't know, they don't know what to do, they may be at their wit's end or maybe really struggling for care and comforting their animal to be able to recommend these kind of things to them is, is a is genuinely a lifesaver to not just the cat, but also to the owners.
Stacy 49:39
Right. And another thing another service and I mentioned it a little bit earlier is, you know, the administering of medications. So, you know, the older a cat gets, the more chance that they're going to have some sort of, you know, medication need or you know, the ability you can charge a nice price. You can give a kidney fluids, um, and so you know it it's a good investment if you are willing to have that sort of that tech hat on. Yeah. So many people with diabetic cats and there's an organization called diabetic cats in need so if you network with them, and if you were able to do insulin injections for cats, I cannot tell you how many people want pet sitters who can handle giving insulin injections to their cats so that then they can travel I mean it is like they have toddlers at home and they feel like they can't get away and you definitely can charge a good price if you're willing to up cat you know their insulin or give a renal failure kitty their fluids. It's not hard to do. It's not it's not brutally difficult but you know, you do have to be kind of okay around needles and that kind of thing. But you can certainly charge a nice a nice figure and you would get known as the person you know who can do that. Also just having the resources of knowing veterinarians, there's some veterinarians that, you know, when the time does come for the cat to have to be, you know, either euthanized or needing end of life care or something like that there are quite a few veterinarians that specialize in that and are willing to come to your house. And that might be a resource that a person wouldn't know about, that you might be able to offer to them for, you know, a really peaceful transition.
Collin 51:26
Yeah, that's so essential. And it's, it's, it's very, it's a very hard process, and people are looking for comfort and support during that time. So to know that there's somebody out there who is humane and is going to do it under the best care impossible circumstances. That's just that's, you know, you see relief in people's eyes whenever you start talking about, you know, peaceful options.
Stacy 51:51
Right. And it's, I mean, it's, it's really, it's a hard hard time but I have to say, if you can do it at home, it's the best way to do it. Hmm, I think from a CAD standpoint because a cat, I've never met a cat who likes going to the veterinarian no matter what, anyway. And so if you're going to take them to the vet for that last last bit, it's it just, you know, it just doesn't make sense. I understand. Obviously, from a financial standpoint, that might not be possible. I'm in rural Vermont. So in my case, it's really hard because the nearest mobile vet is like an hour and a half away. But if you can do it, I think you should definitely explore that option.
Collin 52:34
Yeah, about it's all about knowing your options and what you have on available to you. He touched on this a little bit earlier, when you're talking about your conference, the conferences and all of those kind of resources that you can go there and get a lot of swag and check out some of the cat specific products. Over the years. Have you developed a favorite list of products of brushes, litter boxes, that kind of stuff that you find really reliable or just cats tend to enjoy more
Stacy 53:00
Yeah so I have to say well, there are two types of cat litter that I like. And one is Dr. lcsw. cat litter as well as I also use world's best cat litter. So those are good. I'm not a super fan of like heavy heavy lifters that you have to like very heavy clay and really sticks on the pan and that kind of thing. I am luckily that my cats are pretty, pretty chill about the litter boxes so I have one that is other than the flinging. Fuchun his flinging but I tend to keep my litter boxes as low and wide as possible. Just so that easy and easy out. But I know other people like the tall sided litter box covered litter boxes is a no go in my household And most behaviorists I've talked to say, if your cat has any versions towards the litter box covered is not good because it makes them feel trapped so they're not going to go in there. So they like it being wide and visible. We all want to have it covered because we don't want to see it but unfortunately cats wanted to be as open as possible so that they know that if somebody does come to get them they've got an you know, got a backdoor. Yeah. So and I have for which I have to litter boxes for him. He's an early stage renal failure. And one thing that you may or may not know with renal failure kitties, is they pee a lot. And so over the course of 124 hour period, he'll have been in the box at least six times so I will you know, I, I try to keep up with it as good as possible and he'll tell me if I don't by flinging the litter all around the room. And so anyway so in terms of that's litter so my litter boxes I'm really not that particular route other than I say low and open is as as best and the older cat gets the lower you want to get with the box because they tend to have a harder time getting in and out. I will tell I will say with regards to cats and arthritis I've had great success with arthritic cats with CBD. And I'm not a veterinarian, so I'm disclosing I'm not a veterinarian out there but I did interview a holistic veterinarian in I think she's in Boulder, Colorado, Dr. Angie Krauss, you can go on the community cats podcast calm and you can she does cats and dogs and stuff and you can look at her resources there but she's been a great resource and I also interviewed the folks from pet relief Steve Smith, and they have a company dedicated to CBD products for both cats and dogs and they really know their stuff. They were one of the earlier businesses in the in the game for CBD for pets. So that's those are some really, really good resources and a good product and in terms of foods I feed who I was born and raised with Fancy Feast so he's pretty much a Fancy Feast but it's been with a renal failure I'm I'm always looking for suggestions. So if there are folks out there that have suggestions, I'm always eager for more suggestions because he's becoming a kind of picky eater. And I like the actually also go back I'll use pretty litter too. I don't know if you're familiar with that product, but that's a product so that if, if the cat has a urinary tract infection, the the litter changes color. Oh, nice. So you can use that to see if there might be a and that's great for you know, a cat that you're not gonna really want to work hard to catch for a urine sample or something. You know, it's, it's a great way so I use that periodically just to check in then pretty much also has a grain free dry food and I use that is part of their, their monthly program now, toys for toys um, I like that a cat dancer toy tremendously. I use that a lot. A lot of people use those red lights, the red pen lights for the cats to chase. The one hard thing is you can't the cat can never catch it. And the one thing that's really important and enrichment with cats is making sure that you're giving them the opportunity to win the hunt, or to make the kill or whatever. So at the end of the day, you know you play with them for five or 10 minutes or whatever, you know, the kind of huffing and puffing and whatever. Yeah, let them have it. You let them you know, have it for a moment and sometimes they'll pick it up in their mouth and they'll drag it away and they'll put it in a corner. There's the like the little scrunchie balls that are kind of kind of the kind of quick you know, they're crinkly. Sometimes cats really like those And you know, their toys you can make out of pipe cleaners. If you go on YouTube. There's a kitten lady Hannah Shah, who's also been on our show, has done a couple of do it yourself cat toy videos and with Kate Benjamin. And so with pipe cleaners and some make some cat toys. So there's a lot of do it yourself stuff that works really well. We have these plastic things that were wrapped around boxes that came with us and I just drag it around the house with me and coach comes racing after me and he's just like, it's like he thinks it's the most and of course there's grocery bags and boxes. How can you not talk about cat toys and talk about not talking about, you know, grocery bags and boxes, but you know, those are always the best, best cat toys out there. So it doesn't have to be anything fancy or expensive. It's just you know, they just want to have you engaged in their lives. Sure.
Collin 58:54
So you have been and done a lot of work over the years with spay and neuter program. grams. It's something that you have been invested early on and continue to be involved in. Why is that? so important? And more importantly, I think is is how can other people get involved?
Stacy 59:11
Yeah, sure. So, yeah. So when I first started out in this business back in 1994, you know that many shelters were euthanizing upwards of 70% of the cats in their shelters. And we were really in a severe overpopulation problem with regards to cats. We had a lot of programs that would trap cats, they just bring them in the shelters weren't adopting out a lot of cats and so they would be euthanizing due to space. And in my world, when I joined the Merrimack River, feline rescue society, they were dealing with 300 cats on the waterfront in the small town called Newburyport. And there were like a dozen or so restaurants and the cats would look in the sliding glass windows what people were eating their, you know, steak and lobster dinners and stuff and You know, they'd have runny, goopy eyes and all this stuff and and they did not want to the community. So there was a group of probably about five women who were feeding cats on the waterfront. And that's what they knew to do. They just that's all they knew. They joined with the Chamber of Commerce and they said, decided, well, let's get them all spayed, neutered, so then hopefully that would like slow down the population. So in the first year, they actually trapped and adopted out 125 cats from that area because there were a lot of kittens, they have a lot of litters of kittens, and they actually had earlier had one litter test positive for rabies. So then also there was disease down there too. So anyway, so they trapped 125 cats and placed them and they returned of, you know, another hundred and 50 or so and then there were some cats they had to keep working at trapping. You know, I fast forward through from 94 to 2008. And as of 2008 there No more cats on the waterfront. So, you know, we went from 300 to 03 hundred with 14 feeding stations to zero cats by 2008. So trap neuter return does work, and it can work to reduce the overall cat population. And it's the humane way to go. Because also people would unfortunately drop off cats. I mean, this problem is a problem of, unfortunately, people having cats and they're not able to get the assistance that they need to help those cats whether it's the cat spraying in the house, and they can't afford to get neutered, or if they're moving and they just can't take the cat with them or whatever. But in those early years, we would have cats dropped off down at the waterfront. You know, we have these newcomers that we would have to trap and they'd be totally friendly cats and we'd bring them in and put them up for adoption at our shelter. Now a days that doesn't happen because we we act as an open or the Mr. IFRS acts as an open admission shelter so there's no question Asked if someone needs assistance. They take the cat in without any problems and the cat gets adopted out. It's it's a no kill environment. And so we were able to work in our sort of small pocket of the world, you know, really make change. But as people got to know about our programs, we wanted to be able to do more to help others now, we couldn't expand our shelter programs, but yet we could expand our spay neuter program. So, in 2000, we started feral free feral cat spay neuter weekends, where we got veterinarians to donate their time. And then we also started in 2008, we started our mobile spay neuter clinics, because the reality is this all starts out with, you know, Adam and Eve and Adam and Eve are usually owned by somebody. And you know, my initial objective is if they're going to get abandoned, I want them to be spayed neutered before they get abandoned so that they're not community kittens out there as kittens over 50 percent of kittens don't make get first three months out there, through predators through cars through a whole range through and who wants to stress the mom out that way. I mean, nothing personal. But the miracle of birth for a feral mom is pretty tough out there. So, you know, we don't really want that to happen. And so, you know, that was where I was going with offering as free or as low cost as possible. These mobile spay neuter clinics that go and do 40 cats a day, all around Eastern Massachusetts. And, and so that's what we did, and we got grant money, so we had target zone. So the city of Lowell, we started out in 2008. There they used to euthanize on Fridays because they didn't really want to come and deal with the animals of the weekend. And then they had new management come in very progressive, but they had cats all over the place. It was crazy. What they had back then in terms of the overcrowding in a very small shelter. And the number of cats and then, you know, after about a five year period, they were like, what's a kitten? We don't see any kittens anymore. You know, because we were there. Every Monday we were doing free spay neuter for about three years. We got grant funding for a three year project. And we basically said you know what, no questions asked you bring us a cat that's been spayed or neutered from low we'll do it for free. And it totally solved their problems and their their overpopulation issues, and now they're able to help other communities. Um, to answer your second part of the question about how can folks get involved to help a couple of ways. So, there is a campaign called feline fixed by five. So early age spay neuter is a really important component for cats in preventing having that first litter of kittens cat can get pregnant at four months of age. And so most veterinarians recommend that you wait until six months, but if you as a client or a customer of a veterinarian, go and ask them to just look up feline fixed by five and see if they will Consider trying to fix their client's kittens by five months rather than six. That would solve a tremendous amount of unwanted pregnancies. So that's that's an easy thing that we all can do.
Collin 65:13
Yeah, no. And again, you're being that that resource to the people in your community, to your clients and to their friends and family who have questions, too. And that's such a big part of this because we are a direct interface with law clients, as opposed to people who are more removed or they may not know where to Google or where to look for resources we can we can be that resource to point them in those directions.
Stacy 65:36
Right? Right. And then if you want to, you know, become a heavy hitter or something like that, you could certainly look up your local cat shelter, and you know, volunteer to, you know, help at the shelter or else be a foster home or help with fundraising. There are a lot of people who,
65:55
who
Stacy 65:56
want to you know, do make cat toys or something like that to sell and that kind of thing. So, just a couple of other, you know, options to think about too.
Collin 66:07
Stacey, I want to thank you for coming on today. This has been such a wonderful conversation and a lot of resources have been thrown out there. And there's still so much more to cover. If people want to reach out and get in touch, dig into and find more resources and follow along with your work. How can they do that and get in touch?
Stacy 66:28
Yeah, so folks can really find out anything that they want about me and the programs that we offer at the community cats podcast.com and that's community, community cats podcast calm. We're also on Facebook, we're on Twitter, we're on Instagram. I am personally Stacy lebaron. I'm in LinkedIn. So if there are any pet sitters out there that want to connect with me via LinkedIn, that would be great. Also, feel free to subscribe to the show and we are at Apple podcasts. And YouTube, Google Play Stitcher, Spotify and wherever you like to listen to your favorite podcasts, I guess is the line that we are supposed to say in the podcasting world.
Collin 67:13
It can Yeah, absolutely. I really encourage it. It can be confusing to remember where exactly you are in your you guys are everywhere. And I really encourage our listeners to definitely go and subscribe because there's a ton of resources. You guys have had a lot on a lot of really amazing people to interview and a lot of good things shared there. So Stacy again, thank you so much for coming on. It's been a real pleasure and real joy. Thank you.
67:37
Thank you for having me.
Collin 67:40
I was taking notes like crazy during my conversation with Stacy. No joke, because actual confession here. For a long time. I was one of those people that thought Oh, cats are just jerks and some of them are gonna like you. Some of them are not gonna like you and there's nothing that you as a person can do to change that. Having more exposure and more education around that has really changed how I view them and Stacy just knocked it out of the park time and time again, in that as a pet sitter, we can do things, there are steps we can take. There are processes that we can put in place questions to ask to make sure that those interactions can be as beneficial and as nice as possible, you're not gonna win them all over. And you can only do so much sometimes during one or two drop ins. But as professionals, that's just the effort that we need to be putting into place. We'd like to thank our sponsor time to pet for making this show possible. You can check out our show notes and read a full transcript and find all of the links and resources that were mentioned in this episode and every other episode that we've done on our website at pet sitter confessional.com. There you can find how to get in touch with us how to email us our phone number 636 63648260 in all of the links to get connected with us until next time,
