097- Robin Bennett from The Dog Gurus
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Summary:
Robin Bennett, from the Dog Gurus, joins us to talk all about safety and daycares! Whether you’ve been operating a daycare for 10 years or haven’t even started yet, Robin has something for you. From being careful about zoning in your area to screening dogs, Robin shares some great information that we can all learn from.
Topics on this episode:
How Dog Gurus got started
How to ‘read’ a dog
How do screen dogs for daycare
Limits to off-leash play
Getting started with a daycare
Going from good to great
Hiring and managing staff
Main take away? Never stop learning and lean into the ideas of your staff and others around you.
About our guest:
Robin Bennett is a Certified Professional Dog Trainer, author, speaker, and expert on dogs. She founded one of the largest dog training companies in Virginia and has been using her expertise in “reading dogs” to teach families how to train their pets as well as helping others in the pet care industry keep dogs safe for over 20 years. Robin’s first book, All About Dog Daycare is the number one reference on opening a dog daycare. She is also Co-author of Off-Leash Dog Play… A Complete Guide to Safety and Fun, and an extensive staff training program called, Knowing Dogs, which are the leading staff training resources for dog daycare and boarding facilities. Robin is currently co-founder of The Dog Gurus, the nation’s premier resource for dog care professionals. Through The Dog Gurus she is now helping pet care professionals get their lives back by showing them how to create sustainable businesses with teams that truly know dogs.
Links:
Email Robin: robin@thedoggurus.com
Check out The Dog Gurus: thedoggurus.com
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A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE
Provided by otter.ai
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
dog, daycare, people, pet, business, dog park, started, play, staff, training, pet sitter, body language, canine, parent, employee, trainer, understand, money, leash, day
SPEAKERS
Collin, Robin Bennett
I'm Collin and I'm Meghan. And this is Pet Sitter Confessional, an open and honest discussion about life as a pet sitter brought to you by time to pet.
Collin
Hello, everybody and welcome back. On today's episode, we are so thankful to have Robin Bennett from the dog gurus on to talk about her passion for safety and some tips for everybody looking to open up a daycare or boarding facility. Robin discusses how to retain some great employees and the importance of introspection of ourselves and the role that plays in being an amazing leader for your team. There is a lot to get unpacked. So
Robin Bennett
let's get started. My name is Robin Bennett. I'm the co founder of the dog gurus and have been in the pet industry for 20. Some I just always say 20 some years now, because it's easier than telling people exactly how many years I've been in. But I started out as a certified professional dog trainer, which I still am, and then through the course of my career have kind of more from professional dog training to dog daycare expert to pet care consultant, which is what I do now,
Collin
what were those initial first steps into pet care like for you? How did you get started?
Robin Bennett
Well, ironically, I got started, sort of by accident, and I was in the Marine Corps and I served many years in the Marine Corps and I really, really was interested in dogs but I had never really thought about doing anything. In terms of a career with dogs. I just thought it was a fun thing to play around with. And when I was in the Marine Corps, I actually had asked my commanding officer if I could go to dog training school to learn how to train dogs. I did that. And I came back from that and just started training dogs as a hobby. And it was a lot of fun. It was just sort of a side gig. Well, people started wanting to pay me. And so that was really the first inclination that, hey, I might be able to actually make a living doing this. So I extend it extended in the Marine Corps for a little bit longer, and decided to just kind of decide, is this something I could actually do? Or should I stay in the Marine Corps, and I ended up going into the Marine Corps reserves and finishing out my Marine Corps time that way, and I got out and started my dog training business. So that was really how I got into it. I didn't actually think I could make it into a career, but obviously, it turns out I can. So I started out as a trainer, doing primarily in home lessons, and working out of my car, basically going to people's houses and doing training with them and their dog and I did that for about four years. And then I got tired of living in my car, which I'm sure a lot of people can relate to. I wanted to get a facility. So I ended up getting a small facility as a training studio. And that was really how I kind of stepped into the daycare industry as well.
Collin
So it sounds like those first initial years were really formed by your time in the Marines, how has that continued to shape how you view and operate your business?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, I think the biggest thing with the Marine Corps is that we did do a lot of everything systematized there, obviously, there's processes and procedures and standard operating procedures. And that carried into everything I did in my business. And it turned out that that was a really big blessing for me. But one of the things that happened when I started my daycare, and when I had that facility where I was doing training, my training primarily was in the evenings and on weekends, so during the day, my facility was pretty much empty. So I thought, well, maybe I'll just do this daycare thing because it was really an unknown industry. At that point, the whole daycare industry was fairly new, and I only I knew a couple places that did it. But I said maybe Monday, Wednesday and Friday, I could do this during the day. So I started doing that. And that just took off within a year, I had to go to five days a week. And within another year, I had to hire employees and move to a new location because my daycare just took off. And I wasn't intending that to happen. But that is what happened. But the advantage was because I had started systematizing everything right off the bat, that's just sort of the way I do things. It was really easy to bring on staff and to get them involved and to get them to understand how to help me operate my business. And ultimately, people started asking me how to open dog daycares. And because I had a busy business, you know, as we all know, we don't really have time always to help everybody. So I just put all my SRP stuff together. And I said, Look, you just have this book, just take this book, and you can do it all. I wrote everything down. That book turned into the book called all about dog daycare. Turns out I was trying to get that book out there. So I didn't have to talk to people because I really didn't have time to talk to people. Turns out if you write a book, people want to talk to you more, not less. So that's that's what I found out from writing that book. But it was really just a book that I put together because I had started to systematize and document everything I was doing. And that really came over from the Marine Corps background. And then I think just leadership in general and understanding how to manage and understand how to involve people into your business, I think was helpful from the report as well.
Collin
Sure, yeah, really sound like you were bringing over these the skill set that a lot of people actually struggle with, like that's the leadership and systematizing things are something that everybody has to learn and you you were able to learn that and then bring that over and then share that
Robin Bennett
looking back now I realized that was exactly the case. And I didn't realize how many people do struggle with that because it is so ingrained in me. And so it does, it does turn out to be a really good strength of mine that that I stumbled into Because of my background in the military,
Collin
yeah. Now you talk a little bit about it there. But what was that transition like from running your pet care business running the facility of daycare in turning into coaching and then the dog gurus what how did that process happen?
Robin Bennett
It, it was a very, it was really a gradual process. I started this was probably 615 years ago, maybe 16 years ago, because I had put together what initially was just a spiral bound list of stuff I put together, which I turned into that book. Because I had started having that available, I did start to get asked by industry associations to come speak at their conferences, about daycare. So that was really the starting point was they saw me as someone that could teach it and help others to start it and help others to grow their daycare business to begin with. So I started speaking at conferences and I did start getting people calling me to consult and I started to free up a little bit of my time, but I will tell you that In the midst of all of that, because I now I was in the Marine Corps Reserve, so I was still doing my reserve duty. I had my daycare and my training business. And now I started getting consulting jobs and speaking engagements. I eventually decided that I would sell part of my company, I actually ended up selling the daycare because I just couldn't do everything and just turn more to doing the consulting and traveling around the country, helping others and going into their daycares and speaking. And over time, what I at that time, also partnered with Susan Briggs, who's the other co founder of the dog lovers, we the two of us met at industry conferences, and we've been working together for years, we actually wrote a second book called off leash dog play, which we co authored. And then we, everybody took that book and said, this needs to be a training program. And from that book, we created knowing dogs, which is our staff training program on canine body language. And so that morphed into, again, more people wanting to connect with us just to learn a little bit more about canine body language and how you read dogs. And understand dogs. And through there over the next decade really Susan and I just did sort of a joint venture to help people. And we finally formalized that joint venture by by forming the dog heroes back in 2013. So it was kind of a gradual process and I don't we never sat down and said, Okay, this is where we want to be in 10 years. It just sort of happened over time. And we once we, we knew we could help people with canine body language. And then we started seeing people who did a really good job and were taking great care of the pets, but they just didn't understand the financial side of their business or really how to grow a business. And so we really started Susan has a master's in accountancy. So between her masters of Accountancy, and then my background in the military, we had a good partnership to really reach out and help people with the business side. And that's what we do at the Dogger is now a staff training and business consulting.
Collin
Yeah, it sounds like at each step along the way, it was just shoring up these little things that You saw a need for like Orion cover that, oh, we can cover that we can cover that too to where you guys are today. And that's, I love that story because as you said, it just happened to kind of go as you said, it just happened
Robin Bennett
a little bit at a time. And now we do, you know, plan ahead, but it wasn't like I said, we didn't set out 15 years ago and said 15 years we want to be doing this together. It's and part of it is that we have the passion because Susan also owned her own pet care facility. So we really understand the business ownership side of it. And we understand the long hours and the hard work and the you know all of the work that goes involved with anybody who has seen her pets, and we got tired of seeing people who said, Oh, I can't make money. I'm a, you know, pet sitter, I'm a dog trainer. I'm a daycare owner, whatever, because you can make money, but you have to understand Vince's business principles to do that. And that's what we love to see we those great people who are taking care of such good care of the pets, if we can also help them to make the money. That's the people We want in business, and we want to see them succeed. So that's really where our passion comes from.
Collin
Right? Yeah, making sure that people who want to be in the business are able to be there and make it work for them, too. This is a passion project for a lot of people. And many times we struggle with the business side of it, right? That's in being able to partner with people do some training to help again, shore that up, really does help put people off on a really good grabbing something else that you're really passionate about, and have a long history in working as keeping dogs safe. Where did that Where did that come from? And why do you Why is that so important to focus on?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, so that that really stems from just my love of dogs. And I think all of us in the pet industry, we get into it because we love dogs. So when I was a trainer, I just learned a lot about what now is really more term for free or fear free training methods. So I do I started out with methods that were not in line with that and over time morphed my messages into or my training methodologies into more positive reinforcement Took some classes and kind of learn more about that. And so my whole basis or caring for dogs is that we want to build a relationship with them that's built on, you know, mutual affection and mutual respect and mutual attention on one another. And building that relationship through through positive training methods is the way that I do that. That's the way I like to help others do that as well. Well, then, you know, that affects everything that we do with dogs, what we do at the vet's office, what we do at the daycare, what you do when you're walking a dog. And so we started to I want to really want to help people get the best from their dog as possible without using any harsh or physical methods. So that methodology also goes into how we handle dogs in daycare and even understanding which dogs should be in daycare or which dogs should be in any activity, whether it's, you know, petsitting, training, whatever, like whatever you're going to do with that dog. You want to make sure the dog is happy. So really understanding the dog is part of that making sure that they're happy. And whatever you're doing with them, and then just really helping the daycare providers or pet sitters or trainers use methods that are in line with that as well. And that has always just been a passion of me and Susan's Are we really feel like if we can make the relationship between the pet parent and the dog better, I think the whole world will be better honestly, because I think dogs are just such a they just add so much to our lives.
Collin
Yeah, they really do and what you're describing there is just a holistic approach to safety and relationship building there of it's not just the one on one interactions at you know, it's it's taking the approach to every level of the dog's life and everyone who's caring for it and that idea of helping to build that relationship and educate the pet owner and the the daycare facilities and the dog walkers like that, as you said like that. Nothing but good can come of that,
Robin Bennett
right? Yeah, we really say look at for every single question that people ask me, should I do this with my dog? Should I you know, go to the fireworks with my dog. Should I take them to the vet's office? Should I have this trainer or that trainer? Should I like any of those questions? When it comes down to who should be interacting with your dog, I always just say look at it from the dogs point of view, if you understand what the dog saying, the dog is going to tell you. Are they happy at the fireworks? Are they happy at this pet sitter? Or that pet sitter? Are they happy with this trainer or that trainer? And it's just really, if you can look at everything you're asking about your dog look at it through the lens of what's the dog saying? I think you have a really good way of simplifying all of the discussion that comes down to you know, is this right or that right? I just go What does the dog think about it? It's just a lot easier, have a lens to view and then you get out of the hole. You know, the whole side conversations or arguments or discussions about one way of doing something Or another way of doing something?
Collin
Right. And that is part of what I think how you term it as reading a dog right is understanding that mechanic from their perspective and that those two things sometimes do clash where the owner wants to Do something with the dog. They want them to be a certain type of dog to do certain activities and never take the time to think, well is the dog okay with that is does this dog want to go wakeboarding? Or you know, whatever?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, that's exactly. I did a blog A long time ago that was called my dog got kicked out of daycare. And the art of the blog was basically that a dog got dismissed from daycare because he didn't like it. And the owner contacted me and said, What do I do to fix this? It's so horrible. And the dog was otherwise great like didn't have problems they could walk it they could let it meet other dogs. It just didn't want to play in an awfully playgroup environment. It didn't want to go to dog parks. And I just said, Don't do anything about it. That's not something you can fix. just recognize that your dog would much prefer our company, the company of humans than other dogs. And there's not it's not there's nothing wrong with your dog. And that that blog got so many responses from people who are like, Oh my gosh, I had no idea that Okay, not that's the thing is like we don't all like, go into big parties. I prefer smaller cocktail parties than a big party. I mean, dogs sometimes are the same way I just had actually a friend of mine just told me they took their dog to the dog park. And it went up to every single human in the park, and wouldn't play with any dogs. So they laughed. And I said, that just means your dog is rather be around people than dogs, which is actually a great thing.
Collin
Yeah. Because most of the time we have people struggle with getting their dog to be comfortable around other people, right? That's socializing and getting them used to environment so lean into that that's a strength now what can we do that? What opportunities does that provide for that dog?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, but I think it's just really looking at what does that dog enjoy the most and let's, let's work with that. And so if you need a dog to do a specific thing, like you are getting an agility dog, it does help to hire someone that can help you temperament test that dog to make sure that is going to be a dog that's suitable for agility, but if he's not, then maybe he's going to be great at flyball or this dog or whatever, just find something that he really, really likes, rather than forcing him to like something that maybe is not in his best interest.
Collin
Now for somebody who maybe is either just starting or has maybe not even thought about what it's like to read a dog, they've just been taking care of them for a while. What are some some basics or some things that they can start doing now to build that skill?
Robin Bennett
Some of the easiest things to look at, we really have talked about looking at it and asking yourself, is the dog happy or not? And I can guarantee you that most people if you say, if you show them a picture, and you say, is this dog happy or not happy? Even children, like people of all ages, generally speaking, can look at a picture and say, oh, that dogs not happy or Oh, that dogs really happy. And generally, if you analyze what the canine body language looks like, the happy dogs usually have very relaxed body postures. Sometimes there's bending their legs or their tails, low and relaxing. Their ears are relaxed and 90% of time they have an open mouth. And so those are dogs that are like, Oh, he looks happy. And then if you say what does it look like if they're not happy? Usually again, if you show someone a picture, they'll be able to tell you. But if you actually tell them well, what canine body language signals Do you see? Usually there's stiffening in the dog like they're tightened up, or they're usually they're almost like they're holding their breath, which means their mouth is closed. open mouth. closed mouth is one of the first things we tell people to look at. And then we just tell them are they approaching with, you know, enthusiasm, or they crouch down and trying to back away because of backing away is usually a dog saying that I don't really want to do this right now. We get a lot of really well meaning pet parents who have a dog that's afraid or hiding and somebody comes up and they'll want to greet the dog and the dog is saying I don't want to be petted right now and so they're hiding behind the legs of the pet parent and the pet parent will pull them out from under and go nice, friendly, huh? You know what, if you just Take a second to say, Hey, your dogs really saying I don't want to meet you right now. And usually, if you give them a little bit of time, that dog will come out from behind the legs and go up to me. But they, you have to really let them do it on their own time,
Collin
it's putting that time investment to work with the dog, whether you are walking them on a regular basis, or whether you're doing drop ins, or at helping educate the pet parent to, Hey, have you noticed this about your dog when this scenario comes up? These are some things you know, we can maybe work on.
Robin Bennett
Yeah, and it's best, we find that it's best to help teach pet parents when you look at pictures of a different dog than the one they own. So we do a lot of I mean, we'll rip pictures out of a magazine or there's a lot of books these days that have canine body language photos in them. But you can really take any picture and just show the owner you know, happy you're not happy. And I'm telling you everybody knows this instinctively, they can look at the picture and go happy, not happy. But what you really want to help them look at is what are the really subtle body language signals. So what are the differences in that years between a happy dog and a not happy dog, or what is the difference between the muzzle of a not happy dog or a happy dog. And usually that is just a whole different relaxed look. And usually loose and wiggly body language, you know, those dogs that come up and the whole body is wagging. Those are all happy dogs. And then the dogs that are not happy, are usually much more stiff, their mouth is usually closed, they're usually lower down to the ground, usually more cautious. So getting people to understand those things and then are what we try to teach is how do you get the unhappy dog into a happier state, and that just is really a matter of giving them time giving them distance, sometimes if they're afraid of something, and just really going at the dog's pace.
Collin
Yeah, and it sounds like it's just up here the basic of the power of observation, like if you are around dogs, watch them take notes while either on your phone or if you carry on pen and paper like about the dogs that you're interacting with and caring for to really get to know them. Write more than just going on a walk, we got to feed and we got to give medication.
Robin Bennett
Exactly. And that's the thing that most pet professionals, and I will say especially groomers, they know those signals, they just may not be able to describe them. But a groomer I can tell you a good groomer will move their hand when they're about to get bitten. Right before they're, they know because they know instinctively that but what we haven't done as an industry is we really haven't put words to all of those little tiny, subtle behaviors. They're almost like micro expressions is what they call it in humans. And it's kind of the same thing. Same thing with pet sitters. I mean, they know that certain dogs, they have to be handled a certain way or approached a certain way. And they do that instinctively, because they've been around enough dogs usually. So it's really starting to be able to help define exactly what they're seeing and help us describe that to the owner. Because then the better we educate the pet parents, the better they can be advocates for their own dogs, which I think is huge,
Collin
right? Well because they're spending the vast majority of the time with their dogs and if they aren't putting them in situations where they don't want to be and they are protecting their space and allowing them to tell them what they want to do, that makes for a happier dog and a better experience with them. Right, exactly. On the topic of educating and switching gears just a little bit here, you you also spend time educating on safe off leash play, which I know can be kind of a hot topic for people and and whether it's and how to do it appropriately. What are some basics that we could know about safe off leash play, whether that's in a daycare facility or maybe at a dog park?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, so I think the first thing is this knowing the dog and this is where I do think the pet parent can come into play because they're really going to know what their dog looks like when they're having fun when they're playing. And so when you take that dog to the dog park, I think the first thing is how does that dog out act outside the dog park when they see other dogs? Do they want to play with them? Do they hide? Do they not want to have anything to do with them and Again, I think it goes back to if your dog doesn't like to play with other dogs, it is not a problem. And I would say the majority of dogs don't like dog parks. So I guess I would start with that is to say if your dog doesn't like a dog park, it's in the majority, because I really think it's a smaller number of dogs that really love being in a group with a lot of other dogs. So I think the pet parent understanding Do they really think that's going to be fun for their dog? I also think age comes into play. So generally speaking, we would say dogs about eight, nine months to about three years are on average, the better dogs for a dog park are generally in a more playful mode. That's not to say older dogs won't have fun but they usually do get tired out a little bit more and have a little less patience for really active high energy adolescent dogs. And then I don't really like bringing puppies because I think puppies are better off Wait, I think it's better to wait till the dogs a little bit older before you really expose them to a dog park or a daycare and environment, unless there's a very specific puppy program in place, in which case, I would definitely take your puppy to that. So I think those are the starting points. And then it's really a matter of if you're going to introduce your dog, what do they do when they get in there. And again, it goes back to what is the dog saying. So if they want to go interact, and they're being friendly, and they're engaging in play, and their body language is really loose, then that's awesome. But on the other hand, if you get them into there, and they're hiding under the picnic table, or they're clawing at you, because they want you to pick them up, or they are running to the gate and they want out, then I would say that's a dog that I would just say, today is not a good day for them, or maybe never is a good day for them. But I would take them home, because they're clearly saying I don't want to be here. And it's really not a situation where I would try to force the dog to enjoy it. But I think it goes back to really understanding the dog and then looking at this canine body language signals. The other thing that does come into play, especially in the dog park is dogs have different play styles, just like people, I guess are children. And one play style is not better than the other, but it is a matter of matching the right play style with the right dog. So a dog, for instance, that likes to body slam, which is a lot of the sporting breeds. So Labradors are German German Shorthaired pointers, Golden's, they like to like slam into each other, it's pretty physical play, and that's great for them. But if you put that particular dog with a dog that really doesn't enjoy that play, they might be both great dogs, but they're not going to interact well together. And sometimes that's the problem that happens at a dog park is you have a group of really nice dogs, but they might not have the same play style or they try to play with a dog that doesn't have the replay style and then you can have a fight because the dogs like I don't play that way. That's what a daycare usually helps to prevent that because they're usually grouping dogs based on play style, in part based on play style. So I think that that is important to understand, too. A lot of times, if I'm going to take my dog to a dog park, I'll stand outside the park and kind of watch how all the dogs are playing before I even let my dog in there, because I kind of decide, you know, are they playing? Well? Do they seem friendly? Are they playing with each other nicely? And is there a dog in there? That's going to be a good playmate for my dog? And sometimes there's not. So sometimes they're just all really little dogs, who aren't going to want to be body slammed by my dog. So I just go home or I'll go take them for a walk or whatever. Oh,
Collin
yeah. And you mentioned that that's one key difference between an off leash play at a dog park versus an off leash play in a daycares because they do do some screening or at least some selective that. So what are some of the screening basics for dogs or a daycare facility?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, so any daycare, I think any good daycare should be doing some kind of an evaluation process for the dogs that come into the facility. And they're really looking for is the dog able to be handled, do they mind being interacting with the humans because we want to make sure our The staff can interact with the dog. And then they they will usually introduce them to a small group of different different, usually different kind of temperaments of dogs to see how they interact, so they're really going to see, is this dog interested in being here? Do they want to play with other dogs? And then they will usually put them with larger groups and kind of decide what is the best group for this particular dog. So a good daycare is going to say, you know, this particular dog, let's say, I had a prior lab who did great in small groups, but could not be in a large group so that they would kind of assess that and say, okay, Denver needs to be put with, you know, six or seven other dogs but let's not put them with 20 because he just doesn't do well with 20. And they will put them with the right playmates. So it's really they're evaluating the dog to make sure the dog is wants to be there for one thing, and is going to have fun and I don't really want the dog to just tolerate being there. It's not about well, they're not causing problems. So it doesn't matter that they're just sitting in the corner, we really want that dog to be interacting and engaging with the other dogs. So that's a part of the screening process. And really, that evaluation should be about what's the thing that your dog would like to do the best. And a lot of times people consider it sort of a pass and fail. But I would be looking for a pet care facility, or even a pet sitter or whatever I would be looking for one that's going to say, it's not pass fail, it's your dog. The best thing we can do for your dog is do some training exercise and a walk one on one and play some fetch. And we'll do that with him during the day. But he doesn't really like daycare. Or they might say, Hey, he's great in daycare, so that's what his day is gonna look like he's gonna play with other dogs. So it's more an evaluation of what's the temperament of that dog and what do they enjoy doing?
Collin
Yeah, and I like that because it's getting back to reading the dog and knowing does the dog like this so as a pet care professional, whenever you I have a request to go take care of a dog being honest with him about whether it's actually a good fit for that dog for those reasons that the owners have instead of maybe trying to force it into something or being being open to different options and thinking what is going to be the best outcome for this dog in the end?
Robin Bennett
Right. And I think I think today's pet parent This is a big shift that we've seen in the industry in the last 20 years or so is that I do think pet parents are more discerning now and they really want that individualized care so if you know if you're a pet sitter and you'd let's say you do pack walks, you might find a dog that's not happy doing a pack walk I mean, if you have people take pictures while you're on that pack walk and you have one dog that's yours are down there just crouching along like holy crap, why am I with these five other dogs or whatever? Then for that owner, I might say you know what we do pack walks, but your dog doesn't relate your dog would Matt rather have a one on one, you know, activity with me or with my staff or whatever? Maybe you charge more for that, but figure out the pricing, but it's all about what's the best for the dog and knowing that the owners goal, generally speaking is they want their dog to get some exercise. And the owners don't really know enough to say, okay, we he really needs like 10 minutes of training and five minutes in the pool and 30 minutes doing this. But that's what the program or the package you could create for them is to say, this is what your dog would really like, and it's going to wear them out. So you get your goal of having a tired dog with who gets exercise. But we're going to do that based on what fits your dog the best.
Collin
That really helps you adapt your services to get these really, really small niches. Now, obviously, I'm sure you could go completely overboard if you try and do that for every single one. But take those cases where you think it could really work and dig into that and let the owner know, hey, this is what we can do. This is what we can create to give your dog the best experience because I wholeheartedly agree of the discerning pet parent like they really You know, or they may be more observant as far as whether the dog appears to be happy or sad, right and will openly communicate that to you. And I think we've all experienced that of, wow, they look really happy today, or, oh, they seem kind of down today what happened on the walk or what happened, you know, something like that. So that's just something to keep in mind. I like that of, Okay, if they didn't like that, let's make something that they do like.
Robin Bennett
And even like I had a dog years ago that when I had a pet sitter come over, I told them not to walk her because she was reactive. And now if I had a pet sitter who had training skills, I would have totally had that person walking my dog and working with her on a walk, which I would have expected to pay more for as well. But normally, I would have a pet sitter come over and I would say, Oh, just take her in the backyard. But I would have paid more if that pet sitter would have said, Oh, you know what we can do like a few minutes of training. We'll just play around with some tricks or I'll bring you know, some little agility equipment and we'll play in the backyard. So I do think there's a lot of maybe you noticed pick three or four packages where you can say, Hey, we got the pack walk, we have just a basic single walk with me and the dog or we have this package for dogs that need to stay in the backyard or stay in the house or it might also be something you do if it's raining. But I think there's a lot of those options that then set you apart as not just a pet sitter, but now you have these package packages that you offer as a pet sitter, that are more than just the number of days a week that you're going to walk the dog
Collin
sure really digging into those activities and those other things for the ones who are going to ask for it or need it really right want to touch back on off leash play and because I think that conjures a lot of different ideas of what that looks like for people. Would you say that there are any limits maybe to off leash play as far as things to avoid or best practices for off leash play in managing group sizes, location, that kind of thing?
Robin Bennett
Yeah, we do. We work with some generalizations. So generally speaking in terms of size Like if you're going to do, whether you're going to a dog park or you're going to a daycare or even if you're just going to do off leash play in your backyard or in someone's yard is looking at space, so we would generally recommend 40 to 100 square foot of play space per dog. So that is a rough estimate. 40 would be for really small dogs. So if you've got like a bunch of Beagle sized dogs playing, you could probably go to 40 square foot. And then if you're going to have like labs and German shepherds and Great Danes, you're going to want to be in the 75 to 100 foot range, and we would recommend separating by size so we always, we do recommend separating by playstyle and temperament but we also as a starting point would recommend separating by size just for safety. And so I for instance, won't take my larger dog and where there's really small dogs if I'm going to a dog park and most dog parks now they are starting to create two separate sizes. Two separate yards for dogs are different. sizes, not that the owners always go to the right yard. But I do think that's a consideration. Most daycares will separate by size as well. And then I would say, then I would look at space because you can cram a lot of dogs into a small space. But then when you start to exceed that space ratio, you'll usually see more squabbles and more disagreements and it's just because the dogs don't have enough room to get away from each other if they need a break. So that's one, I'm separating by sizes and other one. And then in terms of supervision, I would not recommend putting more than one person supervising 10 to 15 dogs at the most. And that really depends on the size of the dogs and the experience of the person. So a brand new person that's going to say okay, I'm going to start doing some off leash play, I would start with like three dogs and let them because it really is a learning process of understanding dogs understanding when to intervene and understanding how to read their language in In such a flexible environment where their body language is changing so quickly as they play. So it's really does take some experience to get better at that. So I would say if you're brand new, I wouldn't do more than two to three dogs and then add dogs as you get more comfortable. But a more experienced person could could theoretically supervise and these of course are dogs that are screen that you know they're going to be acceptable and daycare to begin with our dog park, but experienced person could watch up to 15 dogs, they could probably watch more than that, but I we say the standard would be 15 at the most because if you're by yourself and something does happen, it's not a good thing. Like he really need help if you have more than 15 dogs. So that kind of ratio of staff to and that staff that understand what's going on. I mean at a dog park, you'll see a lot of people in there but they aren't paying any attention to the dog. So I'm talking about people that are actually selling supervising the dogs and kind of know, you know what's going on in the in the environment.
Collin
Sure. And I'm sure that changes as you get new dogs into a facility of Okay, well, maybe we'll need to keep these as well, as you mentioned, we'll keep these in a small group to begin with, so we can watch and observe before we put them in the big larger group to see if they like that. And then, you know, making sure people are because yeah, I can, I can't imagine being in charge of 20 dogs and having to intervene in a situation if it went downhill like being able to retain and maintain control over that situation like you do start reaching some of your limits there.
Robin Bennett
Right, exactly.
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Collin
So if somebody is interested in offering daycare, whether that's at a brand new facility or maybe a smaller one in their home, what kind of things should they be thinking of and considering right at the beginning to make sure they get set off on the right path?
Robin Bennett
There's really two things one, well, I guess three, one is that just the zoning zoning tends to be the biggest obstacle before you ever open that hits everybody. So especially if you're going to do it from your home and do it legally, right, but illegally, but if you actually are going to do it and do it legally, getting the zoning is important. So making sure that your city or county, a lot of times they don't even have dogs daycare on the books as a legitimate business because it is so new. So sometimes you have to work with the zoning department to find a location that will allow you to have dogs. So that's really the first thing is to really start researching where you could have that type of business to begin with. The second most important thing that we would say is before you ever bring dogs in is to really get education on canine body language, because that's the number one thing that's going to help you to keep the dog safe. And the sad thing is that if you don't learn that ahead of time, and you're learning it with the dogs in your care, the way you learn is by having injuries, bites or fights or even deaths we've seen, which obviously is not the OJT that I would recommend people get on the job training that people get because you're on the job training experience if you don't have it ahead of time, results in dogs getting injured. So really doing as much as you can and we recommend things like you know volunteering at a shelter that does play groups where you can go in and watch and hopefully someone can help to mentor you that's at the shelter. If you can volunteer at any kind of facility that might be looking for volunteers or even work for one, assuming you're it's not your competition is that's that would be sort of rude. But if it's far enough away where you can get some assistance that way, obviously, the doggers offers a canine body language training course there's a ton of books out now that talk about canine body language, going to dog parks and just sitting and watching will teach you a ton. You'll see a lot of stuff you shouldn't see in your daycare if you go to dog parks. But all of that education really should happen before you start bringing dogs in. And I will say as a I was a trainer for years before I did my daycare, and I honestly thought the daycare would be easy. I really did say like wow, I'm a trainer I know about canine body language. And I can still remember the day I had my first four dogs in daycare and I thought it was a heart attack. It's so Much different as all I can tell you. It's because in my training classes, it's always dogs on leash. So I did understand to some extent canine body language, but it's not at all what you see when you take the leashes off and you let the dog start interaction interacting. So it is, you know, I would say like I said, groomers tend to be really good at reading dogs, because a lot of times, unfortunately, they've been bitten. And I think a lot of us with dog experience, whether you're a pet sitter or a trainer, you worked in a kennel, I think, you know, a lot, but unless you actually have worked with groups of dogs, I don't think anyone has a leg up on anyone else in the industry. I think the only way you can get better at supervising dogs in a daycare environment is to do it. So you need to get that experience and that practice ideally beforehand.
Collin
Sure, yeah. And and starting off small, as you mentioned, right. Okay, like what I'm brand new to this or maybe I have a brand new employee. We're going to start them off with With three or four dogs, and we're going to talk to them about what they saw and do some debriefings, and really start digging into that so that you don't wind up. You know, in a situation where you're completely out of control, you have no idea what's going on. Because you know, you haven't been exposed to that kind of dynamic, just how uniquely different that is.
Robin Bennett
Yeah. And then I would say, the third thing is, just be prepared to know what your limit is. So if you get x number of dogs, at what point you're going to start hiring staff, because then staffing bringing on staff becomes a whole separate issue in a business. So and some people don't want to do that. They want to always remain small, which is fine, but just recognizing like, what's going to be your max number, and of dogs that you've been watching, and I would say the other thing I would really we tell people now is that the day long play model where you drop the dog off in the morning, they play all day and you pick them up at night, that model is really starting to become obsolete, I would say it's really a commodity model. Which means if it's a commodity people are price shopping. So you'll get people that are like, Oh, you're cheaper than them. Okay, I'll go to you, which isn't really necessarily the clients you want. But we because we now recommend really doing enrichment based model, which is smaller groups, more high touch more of that kind of concierge field where you're tailoring the day to the actual individual dog. And usually, there's a lot more engagement with the staff. So they still do group play, but they might do group play for like an hour, and then they'll go down for rest time, or they'll get a puzzle toy or something in their enclosure to interact one, you know, individually, and then they might come out and work with a trainer or enrichment counselor who just does some fun games with them, and then they might do group play again. So it's more of a tailored more structured day and smaller groups, but you also charge more for it. So it's, I think it's healthier for the dogs. The staff generally have way more fun, because now they actually can play with the dogs and stuff with the dogs, and then it's more profitable for the business.
Collin
Sure. And my next question here, I guess is going to depend on which model you choose on how to run your your daycare. But how does running a daycare differ as you go from a small scale to a large scale operation? And again, I think that will may differ depending on what kind of model you choose to go with. But it was curious kind of how you would approach that.
Robin Bennett
Yeah, I think the biggest difference is in staff in terms of staffing, I mean that the hardest thing about scaling your business is getting a staff that can help you to scale because otherwise and getting the staff to be able to do things so that you as the business owner can actually run the business. And you have to you have to as the business owner, you have to be willing to step away from some of the things that you may have started doing because those are the things you like to do to begin with. And what I mean by that is I got into I got into the business initially to train dogs. Well after About 10 years I was training dogs very little. I went from working as being the only one in the daycare. And after about four years of that I wasn't in the daycare hardly at all. I just didn't have time to be in there. So if but I had to be okay with that, too. And some people aren't. Some people would rather say I want to continue to be the Dewar, I want to I want to be in the daycare, I want to be the trainer, I want to do all that. And they may not want to grow any bigger. But if you want to grow bigger, and you're going to be the business owner, then usually it does result in a change of your role into more of running the business. And you hire good people that can start to do the work that you've been doing, usually for years. And that can be a hard transition. And there's a great book called The E myth revisited. And so we always tell people, it's by Michael Gerber. We always tell people to read that because it really goes through kind of understanding that transition from a small business into scaling your business, and staffing ends up becoming one of the biggest challenges because You have to be able to be good enough with people that you can bring a good staff in and be a good manager of those people. And sometimes that's a skill set that people haven't really had practice with.
Collin
Well, right, because usually they get to that point of needing to scale and they look around and go, Okay, I guess I hire somebody. Now. I guess that's the next thing I do. You want to me? Okay, great. And sometimes that works out sometimes. It doesn't. What would you tell somebody who has maybe been burned because they tried to hire somebody, and it just didn't work out for them?
Robin Bennett
So that's a great question. We usually talk about two things. One is systematizing. And documenting everything. So that goes kind of goes back to what we talked about at the beginning is the greatest team players, the, the a team that we all want. Those are people who don't want to step into a chaotic work environment. Those are the people that are like, they want to see some clear path. They want to understand what their responsibilities are. They want to know what their job is. Which means usually you want to have all that written out. So Having a strong SAP and having strong processes and procedures is the one of the best ways to get a good employee right from the start. And it's also the best way to find a bad employee as quickly as possible. So you let them go, because you have everything documented. They're either doing it or they're not. And it's not a matter of, obviously, you have to train them. So but it's once they've been trained, it's not a matter of I'm doing it this way. Because I feel like it it's like, well, here's our policy, if you're not doing it the way our policy is, then you need to go somewhere else. So it's easier to let people go but it's also those people that are really strong, staff, employees, they're really great ones that we all want. They want to come into something that they can help to grow and help to make it something big. They don't want to come in and it's like total chaos. So when they come in, it's like day one of training is you're with them all day introducing them to people. Day two of training, you're busy so you go hey Rhonda, can you take the new guy and go teach them something day three, like forgot you even hired someone and you're just like back in the weeds. And that person's like, what is the process for training me like, I'm just, it's just like all ad hoc, and I'm just, like thrown in the mix. The really, you're really good employees and think about it for any that's what I always tell people, for those of us who are entrepreneurs, we wouldn't walk into that either. Like we don't want to go work for someone that's totally doesn't have their act together. And so that's the first thing is we say, document your processes, procedures, make sure you have a good training method when you bring that person on and they're cared for and they're taught well, and you're showing good leadership because that's really what that is. But then the second thing is making sure that we look at yourself, so making sure that you're actually a good person to work for too. And unfortunately, we have that conversation a lot to say. And honestly for me, I ended up hiring a training manager who was way better with the staff than I was because in a lot of respects, my Marine Corps background was awesome. But to be honest, in terms of how I interacted with my staff, Marine Corps background is not the best. Because it's a little too direct. I mean, the big joke was I would routinely make my staff cry. And I'd be like, why are they crying? I just told them what to do. But it was just the moral of the military directness doesn't necessarily translate that part of my military background didn't translate well to the pet industry. And so I did have to learn to sort of tailor how my communication style worked with my team. But I ended up hiring a manager who became the the employee, the staff manager, and she was so much better at it. So some of the times it is like recognizing in ourselves what we need to change or improve, to be a better leader. And so if you have constant turnover, like you're constantly hiring and firing, hiring, firing or hiring and the people quit hiring people quit, and you just have this revolving door. I would look at yourself and say, What is it About what I'm doing that I can change to make this better. And that's unfortunately, hard to do. But I think that's a growth opportunity for every business owner.
Collin
Yeah. And I like that taking that first step of if you've been burned by an employee hire relooking at those slps. And those procedures, making sure those are watertight first, yeah. And then doing some introspection, which is never fun, and it's never comfortable. But if you're in the need, if you really need to be bringing on employees, you've got to take that step as well. And then, as you mentioned, if you assess and you realize, maybe I'm not the best person for this, maybe my first hire is somebody who hires.
Robin Bennett
Exactly, exactly. Yeah, exactly. And it's just really identifying like, what, what are you good at and then where can you bring in the people that you surround yourself that are going to be better than you in those areas.
Collin
If somebody has been running a daycare for a while and they've kind of got their eye on scaling and growing, but What would you say to somebody who wants that but doesn't even know where to start? Maybe doesn't even know the right questions to be asking.
Robin Bennett
Yeah, we, we actually have a free download, you can go on our website, and it's called the 10 steps of sustainability. And it's really about those exact steps. Like if you're going to grow your business, here's the 10 steps, and we haven't, you know, one through 10. But the reality is they you're going to go 12322, you know, you're gonna jump around a little. But it really does start with understanding your numbers. And really understanding what those numbers say about your business and what your key performance measures are. And then from there, and we start with the numbers because generally anything after that is going to be adjusting numbers for more profit, or getting more money to buy something so that you can expand or buy more software, whatever. So we start with the numbers because usually revenue really profit becomes a critical part to how to scale in the first place. But really, I find that the majority of pet businesses across the board, whether it's pet sitters, trainers, kennel operators, daycare operators, I don't know the numbers as well as they should. And because again, most of us got involved with this because we love dogs, none of us wants to sit down and do a budget or sit down and you know, go over all their key metrics because they'd rather be spending time with the dogs. But the most successful businesses that we see and this is time and time, again, are the ones that go through the challenging process of really understanding their numbers. And we have Susan because she has a master's in accountancy. She's created a ton of templates that we when we are coaching with people that we walk them through, and I can tell you that people don't like them, the people, but if you're willing to put the work in, once you understand your numbers, they become really, really powerful. So if you have a spreadsheet where you can say this is a simple example But if you really understand how much you're making per dog, and then you just ask yourself, okay, we've service 4000, you know, different clients or different services last year, and you just ask yourself, what if we increased by 50 cents, every single service, like those on the you know, if you just make that little change on the spreadsheet, and you see the calculation on the other end, you're like, oh, like, they become really powerful. When we were working with people on converting from that day long play, like I talked about with daycare, to a enrichment model. And with the enrichment model, you actually end up with a little bit more staff, but you are charging more, and you end up with fewer dogs and more money. And when you see that in a spreadsheet, you're like, this is a no brainer, like we should just stop doing what we're doing and convert to this, this other program because it's easy to see it. We also help people make decisions on Should I add this service or not. And then we look at we have a formula to go through and forecast What's the money? What money is it going to bring in? And it helps them to make decisions. So all the decisions, the most common question I get, and this is sort of my pet peeve, I kind of joke about it now, because people will call me and they'll go, I'm going to add this activity. What should I charge? Like? That's the question I get all the time. And then I'm like, Well, what does it cost you to run that? They have no idea? So something as simple as understanding what's your cost? like to go and do one petsitting job? What does it cost you? Like how much in gas? How much give a portion of your car, you know, wear and tear, whatever you're paying that employee or whatever, any kind of treats that you might use? What does it cost you, if you write a note, you know, what does that paper cost you or document that you're leaving, and figure that out? Because you really don't want to set prices until you know what it's costing you. So I think the numbers is a huge thing. And that's the number one place to start. And if you don't understand your numbers, that's that's where all of our consulting programs start pretty much It's like, Okay, let's go back to the numbers,
Collin
right? Because I see that in tons of Facebook groups and hear people all the time, I don't know what to charge for this, how do I make more money? How do I do this how to do that. And it comes down to, as you said, like if you if you don't understand that per dog transaction cost, like that is so powerful. And I, I love playing with spreadsheets too, and just changing like a number. Yeah, seeing it go, you know, populate, and especially if you, you know, if you're doing it at a set at a certain scale, like, that adds up so quickly. And I'm sure that can help overcome maybe an uneasiness to raise prices or charge what you need to going, Wow, like, look at that huge difference just this small increment makes over the course of a year and then over two years, and wow, like, if you don't have that in black and white, you'd never see that.
Robin Bennett
And most of the time that extra money is direct to the bottom line, which means it's a money that you have to either give salary raises or take a paycheck. Increase yourself. As a business owner, so we what we what we often tell people because nobody likes to raise prices. So we always tell people, if you have those numbers down, then just do three different versions of it. And I always tell people do your regular rate, like, here's what I'm making. And then here's what you're going to make with the exact same number of clients, or exact same number of dogs, if you raise your rates, and then usually everyone's thrilled with that, that spreadsheet, but then I all but then I always say because the fear of raising their prices is people think they're going to lose clients. So then I say we'll do one now where you just figure you lost 20% of your clients, nine times out of 10 with the price increase and a loss of 20% of the clients. You still make more than that spreadsheet a and so it usually it helps people to overcome the okay if I do lose clients, I'm still gonna make money like there is the emotional side of losing clients you have to get over right and we that does get hard because we all know we fall in love with the dogs and a lot of the pet parents as well. So we don't want to lose the dog. But at least from a financial standpoint, and then nobody ever loses 20% of clients. So it always ends up, they lose way less than in our mind, we think we're going to lose. So and the other thing I will say is, I would do all those financials by service. And so we really stress and this is the other big area with our industry that we see as a, I don't know, I want to say flaw, but I just think we never taught it this way. So we'll let's say we'll work with a company who has daycare, boarding training, and petsitting. And they have so they have four different service streams will tell them break all your service streams out to see if they're profitable independently. And I can't even tell you how many times we've seen a profitable company, they're making money so they look good. When they break out their cert, their revenue streams. boarding is usually making a fortune and daycare a lot of times is losing money. And so they're actually their company is called profitable because their boarding is doing so well. Well, and so the board is basically holding update here. So in that situation, if they just stopped doing daycare, they would instantly make more money, which is kind of odd, which nobody really wants to do. But then we do talk to them about Look, your prices aren't aren't set right for daycare. So we really need to help work with that. But a lot of people have no idea that's the case that basically one service stream is cannibalizing the other, almost a break those out. And for those that were doing that during COVID, they found out quickly as soon as all their lodging stopped. Now their daycare still running, but they're still losing money, and they weren't sure why. And so we had we actually worked with a lot of clients over the last several months who were in that boat. They had no idea their daycare was not a profitable part of their business. Until boarding went away completely.
Collin
Yeah. And it was that revenue stream was forced to be sit on its own and only own laurels and yeah, I can serve people sitting there going, Oh, this isn't nearly enough. Like I don't understand.
Robin Bennett
Exactly. And that's the same thing, if you do different petsitting options, making sure that each of those is profitable. And same thing with trainers, if you're doing group classes, those need to be profitable private lessons need to be profitable. They may not be equal in terms of profitability, but we just don't want one service stream losing money. And because then you're basically taking that money out of the other revenue stream.
Collin
Yeah, you're subsidizing that three losses on these other ones and going okay, is it negative because it's not needed? Is it negative because of my operating expenses? What and starting addressing those concerns? And maybe like you said, The answer may be can we get rid of that entirely? Or, or we make changes to it in the same vein of looking to scale looking to grow? What would you say takes a daycare or boarding facility from good to great in the eye of a client?
Robin Bennett
I think a lot of it is communication, to be honest. I would love to say it's how you take care of the dogs. That's what I really want it to be. Because Because character Quality really should matter, unfortunately. And I do think it does matter. But unfortunately, I don't think the pet parents really understand the questions to even ask. So I think if you can, most of the great facilities and this is true across the board with any pet industry, if you're doing a really good job, you probably think all the stuff you do is normal and that pet parents assume you do it. But I can tell you that they don't. So making sure that the pet parents know they know that you're certified. If you've got certifications, they know that you're going and doing continuing education, they know that all of your team is trained in first aid or CPR, making sure that all those because that does come down to care quality. And so care quality, I think is important, but it really comes down to are you communicating that to the pet parent, because a lot of people are just doing it and the pet parent has no idea. But then I also think customer service. So how well you're treating your clients just on the you know, just in terms of how you answer the phone, and how you're doing To them, when you see them and how you take care of them if they have a complaint. I think all of that stands apart too. And I think I really think Customer service is one of the biggest deciding factors for pet parents. And a lot of times, it's not the bells and whistles and how pretty your facility looks. I think all those are great initially. And that might attract someone initially, but nobody is going to stay. If they're treated poorly, and you have, you know, the four star environment, but you treat the people poorly, they'll leave and they'll go to, you know, something that looks older and more dingy, if they're really taken care of. I mean, that's what we see over and over again.
Collin
Yeah, it's a reminder that we can love the dog as much as we can when they're in our care. But if we don't tell the client about it or make sure that they're happy and they're taking care of it won't you know in the end, if they don't see that they don't know that if they don't feel like they are seen or you know, you mentioned customer service there if that's not also extremely exceedingly high, they will go. And so remembering that it's against this holistic approach to what it's like to run your business.
Robin Bennett
Exactly. And I think so many of us get involved with dogs because we love the animals and not so much people. Yes. So I really do stress you have to be not, you know, you have to really like people to do really well in this industry. Because at the end of the day, it's the pet parent who's paying for their dog to come. And so if you're not good with people, then again, hire someone who has come out of the hospitality industry who has a really good background in that because it really does make a difference. And we see that a lot of times we see someone who says, I don't have enough money to you know, make this look so pretty, and put the chandelier up and have all of this, you know, really amazing stuff. And it doesn't matter. Like if you do a really good job with customer service, and you're showing them the carrier provided to their dog. They're gonna stick with you,
Collin
right? Yeah, love dogs love people. Take care. have both and you'll see you'll see great success. Exactly. As far as bringing on a staff. We've touched on it a couple times here, what are some ways that we make sure that we are educating our staff the best possible so that we retain them for the long run.
Robin Bennett
So I do say, that is my one number one criteria is hire nice people when you're hiring or team members in terms of and because I think there's some stuff we can train, we can train all of the things about how to interact with the dogs, you can train canine body language, how to understand how to read dogs, you can train all that, but you can't really, you kind of are stuck with whatever that person is like personality wise. So all of the sort of chemistry making sure that they interact with your other staff members well, and they're going to create a good team atmosphere I think is really important just on the terms of hiring and bringing them on. And then once you do hire, I think training is huge. I think again, going to having a formal process where you have it mapped out From day one, too, could be a month, it could be three months depending on what their job is. But you have every day when that person comes to work, what you're going to be having them do. And obviously, as they get trained, you're giving them more responsibility. But I think having a formal training program for everything that person needs to learn, and it's not. And it's done systematically. It's not just you hire them, and you just get them to do whatever you need done that day. Because then there's just no system behind it. And if you're not really sure how well this person's being trained, so having a formal training program, I think is huge. That's that's actually is one of the big things that we have at the dog ears is we have a whole program that people can use. It's called pet guru college, which is a formal training program for enrichment, daycare, lodging and client care positions, because it just doesn't really exist anywhere in the industry. So you either create something on your own or get something and supplement with your own slps but I think that's the biggest way of keeping your staff engaged, I think, making sure that you're keeping them happy. And I know a lot of a lot of owners are older, I'll say, my age and their 50s. And we have this mentality of like, they should just do it because we told them, and that just doesn't work. I mean, frankly, it probably didn't work that well when I was younger, but I was in the Marine Corps. So I did pretty much just do what I was. But I do think now that there's a lot more of a desire from and I'll say millennials kind of get a bad rap, because we're always like all millennials, they don't do a good job or whatever. I don't really think that's true. I just think that they want to have a little bit more buy in. And they aren't going to do it just because they're told they were told they want to know the why behind it. Why is it important, and they want to have a little bit of buy into where it's going. So if you're able to engage them in the mission of your business, you'll have an amazing employee. But a lot of us don't really take the time to do that. We're just we just Need a warm body and we want them to do XYZ. And that just isn't a good long term solution
Collin
for not being put off when somebody wants to know a little bit more about what's going on and why they're doing it. Right, leaning into that and going, Okay, this person is asking questions like, let's, let's give them more, let's talk about this and seeing that as a good sign to invest more into them, and help them see the process.
Robin Bennett
Yeah, that is so true. A lot of times we get those questions, and then we're just annoyed, like, why are you asking questions? But if you really understand explaining the why to that person is going to help them be a better employee, then I would we recommend building that into everything that you're teaching anyway, because they really should know why you're doing it.
Collin
And maybe you need to know why you're doing it. Maybe you haven't really addressed or thought about that for a while. And that question should be you know, you should welcome that and go, okay. Yeah, we're still gonna do it this way. But this is why
Robin Bennett
Yeah, and I think I think being willing to listen to my I always say the best Some of the best things I ever did at my facility were employee recommendations. And initially that I mean, I will say the first couple years, that wasn't the case, they would bring in a suggestion. And I'd be like, now we're doing it my way. And then I did have to learn, like, let's look at, here's the and I actually I found out for me, I have a totally different way of looking at things, which I think is normal, but I think it's actually not normal. I used to, but my staff would come in and I finally said, Look, here's the end result. Here's how I would get there. And they would say, here's how we would get there. And if we got to the same end result, and that was the same amount of time. And you know, there was no reason not to do it the employees way. Some of the best things I ever did well, because my employee suggested it. So I think you have to be willing to say there's a better way than maybe your way and i and i for me, that took me a little bit of time to come to that conclusion. But I did finally start to say you know, I should be listening to them because they're really the ones doing it. So all things considered equal. If it's not costing me more money, it's not costing me more time the end results the same, then why not? And it helps employees to have a lot more buy in on the way you're doing business.
Collin
And that allows them to feel like they're contributing and feel like they're valued as well and potentially improve things like you'd like you have experience with seeing that process being better at the end. I wanted to end with two big number ones from you, too. The first one is, what is the number one safety concern that not enough people are concerned about?
Robin Bennett
Honestly, I think it's not understanding how to read dogs. I think time and time again, people are doing things with the right intention, like they mean well, but if you and I'll give daycare as an example, like they mean well by giving these dogs an outlet and daycare, and then you have a dog that's just completely miserable. That dog shouldn't be in there. I think it's just but they have the right intention. Like they're thinking this is helping the owner and the dogs getting out and They're not sitting in a room all day or whatever. But I think the biggest thing that I don't think people pay enough attention to is what is the dog saying in this whole thing. And that's, that's with any, any pet care industry, it could be, I mean, including pet parents, you know, their take their dog to the fireworks and then the dogs like powering and freaking out, and they have their that's the best of intentions. They're like, but we're out, you know, having fun together as a family. But if you look at the dog who's like, completely traumatized a lot of times from any kind of outing issues, fireworks, because it was just, you know, a month ago in the fourth of July, do I think it's just really understanding what the dog is saying and how to keep the dog safe by being an advocate for the dog
Collin
advocate such a huge word there is that that's really where we want to be and we want to help the the pet parents to be an advocate for them, too. Yeah,
Robin Bennett
that's really honestly that is one of my strongest considerations for anyone in the pet professional field. So if you're a trainer veterinarian, a dog groomer, a pet sitter, you know, daycare, boarding, whatever, if you're in the pet industry, you could own a retail store, if you're in the pet industry, that you are the biggest conduit to pet parents. And so I think for all those pet professionals, they all need to know enough about canine body language to teach the pet parents who they see every single day. Because if we did that, just think of how much better lives dogs lives would be all over the world. Whatever world you know, someone has access to a pet parent. I just think we could influence the whole world that way. But it means that those pet professionals have to know enough and be able to communicate it well enough to a pet parent to help them and they're seeing him all the time.
Collin
Yeah, and and as you mentioned, a lot of times we might not have that exactly codified or know how to verbalize that. But taking that time to observe and spending some moments to write that down so that the owner can understand that is really the best one of the best ones. ways we can be an advocate for him. Exactly. And then maybe we answered it, but what is your number one piece of advice for a pet care provider?
Robin Bennett
Well, I would say that canine body language definitely but I would also say for anyone that's in doing this as a business is to do it as a business. So I know a lot of people that really are like Oh, I just want to do it as a hobby, which is fine. The only reason I stress running it as a business is because your as a hobbyist, you're more likely to stop doing it and you're more likely to burn out doing it which means you're gonna stop doing it. Those professionals who are really doing the best job and the ones that love the dogs, the best care for the dogs in the best are really providing the best service possible. I want them to make money so that they will do it for a long long time. Because those are the businesses I want to succeed. I don't want the you know, person to succeed that runs crappy business but runs a crappy care quality for the dogs but happens to understand business. So they're making money but I would never have Send a dog to them because they don't care about the dogs. So that's that's my quandary as a consultant is those are the people, I see people who really understand business, they get into it because of the business. But they have crappy care quality. I don't want to send my dogs to them. But those are the businesses that are going to be around a long time because they're running their business effectively. So that's why the all those dog lovers who get into it because they love the dogs, I just want them to learn enough about the business side of it so that they make money. They don't burn out. And they can be successful for a long period of time because they're going to impact more dogs lives.
Collin
I love that. Robin, thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule. You're welcome to come on the show today and share your experiences and your knowledge about safety and managing daycares and how to be a healthy business and how to operate successfully. But I know we just barely scratched the surface in this. So if people have more questions, want to reach out, find out some more information, how can they best do that?
Robin Bennett
Thank you contact me directly at my email, which is Robin or ob i n at the dog gurus calm. And they can also just go to our website, the dog gurus calm. And we have all of our information out there about the different program. Most of our services are online so they can get started right away. But we have staff training programs and we have business consultant programs on that website as well.
Collin
Well, I'll have links to all that in several of the other resources that we mentioned in the show notes and on our website so people can find them very easily. Sounds great. Thanks so much for having me. My big takeaway from my conversation with Robin was when she discussed the one thing that takes a good facility and turns it into a great one. We all want to think that it's the level of care that if we just love the dogs more, like I said, if we just love them more, that will make all the difference. But it's taking care of the people. It's communicating with them. It's providing them the best possible service, and that can be challenging. Sometimes the people aren't exactly our favorite on most days. But it's encouraging to know that there are things that we can do. There are small steps that we can make in communicating with others to help make the entire experience from booking to out the door. better for everybody. We'd like to thank our sponsor time to pet for making this week's show possible, and head on over to time to pet.com forward slash confessional to get that discount on your first three months, Megan and I want to thank you, from the bottom of our hearts for listening to this and all of our episodes. It's so humbling to know that you are out there and that this is beneficial to you. Thank you once again and we'll be back again soon.
